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2tone
Ten-Towns
Post #91
Wednesday September 11, 2013 11:54pm

Joined Jul 2012
Total Posts: 4,664
Original post from rainORshine

like i said, as soon as US wins the ball, the 6 drops in between the CBs - gets out of the way / offensively functions as an extra CB. problem solved. also that allows OBs to push forward. as soon as lose ball 6 steps into midfield - which also negates almost any counter-attack

--LCB-jones-RCB--


It's been tried, and it didn't work.

dunlopp9987
Post #92
Wednesday September 11, 2013 11:55pm

Joined Mar 2013
Total Posts: 837
Original post from Fraser31

And I don't meant that in the sense of the role of creative midfield but is he creative... As a midfielder.


Yes. Ten times more so than anyone besides MB.
COYB!!
rainORshine
Post #93
Thursday September 12, 2013 12:01am

Joined Dec 2012
Total Posts: 1,768
Original post from 2tone

It's been tried, and it didn't work.


nope

EKneezy
Post #94
Thursday September 12, 2013 2:02am

Joined May 2013
Total Posts: 1,634
On one Mexico breakaway, Beckerman's lack of pace and agility was evident as the Mexican player( I believe it was Gimenez) gave him a little fake and blew by him. Bedoya fouled him and all was good. Beckerman is a fantastic bench option . Him starting is a plan C option however. Last night's game also showed me how if Klinsmann can reign in JJ we will be a better team.

Fraser31
Charleston, South Carolina
Post #95
Thursday September 12, 2013 2:39am

Joined Sep 2012
Total Posts: 925
Well we have left and right wing options in Donovan and FJ. Dempsey doesn't seem to be getting it done for some, if Dempsey does get benched would it be outrageous if kljestan got a look at Cam?

Rey Regicide
Post #96
Thursday September 12, 2013 2:50pm

Joined Sep 2013
Total Posts: 146
Original post from Fraser31

Well we have left and right wing options in Donovan and FJ. Dempsey doesn't seem to be getting it done for some, if Dempsey does get benched would it be outrageous if kljestan got a look at Cam?


I've been feeling the same about Dempsey, for the way we want to play we need the guy underneath Altidore or EJ or potentially AJ to be as dynamic as hell. Dempsey, man he just doesn't feel like he's the guy to do that.

Yo, how does this sound for you guys, want to hear this out from everyone. The problem wiht the 4 3 3 was that our middle 3 was too similar and static. But with Jones and Bradley expressing themselves individually, at times to the detriment to the collective, which would explain how Cameron looks better next to Bradley. What if we took someone like Beckerman, either Cameron, Edu, Beckerman himself, or any CDM and place him in between the centerbacks. So he would rarely get exposed, then in a staggered shape with license to go anywhere they please, Jones and Bradley would occupy the middle positions. I mean anywhere, from the middle to the touchline to the by line. It's theirs. Up top, Altidore flanked by a more dynamic AJ supporting him. Below them two, in the 3/4 role, our trequartista Donovan. What do you guys think? I'm going to input this into my fifa and find out haha.

rainORshine
Post #97
Thursday September 12, 2013 4:34pm

Joined Dec 2012
Total Posts: 1,768
Original post from Fraser31

Well we have left and right wing options in Donovan and FJ. Dempsey doesn't seem to be getting it done for some, if Dempsey does get benched would it be outrageous if kljestan got a look at Cam?


not outrageous but highly unlikely and probably not a good idea. kljestan is not really a CAM, he is an 8. diskerud is probably the closest we have to a CAM

more importantly you want to encourage bradley making runs forward and a CAM will clog that space

dempsey plays more like a 2nd forward. he will at times come towards midfield for a touch of the ball, but almost always it is one touch back to whoever passed to him and then he circulates forward again. he really does nothing to facilitate offense from midfield (not a CAM)

donovan or johannsson are most likely replacements for dempsey, if that were to happen

rainORshine
Post #98
Thursday September 12, 2013 4:45pm

Joined Dec 2012
Total Posts: 1,768
Original post from Rey Regicide

I've been feeling the same about Dempsey, for the way we want to play we need the guy underneath Altidore or EJ or potentially AJ to be as dynamic as hell. Dempsey, man he just doesn't feel like he's the guy to do that.

Yo, how does this sound for you guys, want to hear this out from everyone. The problem wiht the 4 3 3 was that our middle 3 was too similar and static. But with Jones and Bradley expressing themselves individually, at times to the detriment to the collective, which would explain how Cameron looks better next to Bradley. What if we took someone like Beckerman, either Cameron, Edu, Beckerman himself, or any CDM and place him in between the centerbacks. So he would rarely get exposed, then in a staggered shape with license to go anywhere they please, Jones and Bradley would occupy the middle positions. I mean anywhere, from the middle to the touchline to the by line. It's theirs. Up top, Altidore flanked by a more dynamic AJ supporting him. Below them two, in the 3/4 role, our trequartista Donovan. What do you guys think? I'm going to input this into my fifa and find out haha.


this IS something we have seen. we have seen edu fill that role behind bradley and jones 4 times, williams twice and beckerman once

most people thought adding a CDM to bradley/jones was a bad idea and it proved to be a bad idea.

what we have not seen is jones as a 6 (CDM) and pairing kljestan with bradley in the center of the field

in this scenario jones would offensively drop between CBs (as he did occasionally against mexico) to help distribute to bradley and kljestan from back and at times send long diagonal balls forward, which he is pretty proficient at

in current set-up bradley provides primary outlet for CBs while jones clears UP the field - where he is essentially useless

Rey Regicide
Post #99
Thursday September 12, 2013 4:52pm

Joined Sep 2013
Total Posts: 146
Original post from rainORshine

this IS something we have seen. we have seen edu fill that role behind bradley and jones 4 times, williams twice and beckerman once

most people thought adding a CDM to bradley/jones was a bad idea and it proved to be a bad idea.

what we have not seen is jones as a 6 (CDM) and pairing kljestan with bradley in the center of the field

in this scenario jones would offensively drop between CBs (as he did occasionally against mexico) to help distribute to bradley and kljestan from back and at times send long diagonal balls forward, which he is pretty proficient at

in current set-up bradley provides primary outlet for CBs while jones clears UP the field - where he is essentially useless


So you are saying that Bradley and Jones are too similar? In the 4 3 3, or that Edu and Williams were insufficient cover by themselves?

I've read enough in prior posts to understand your affinity towards Kljestan. Truth be told, I don't understand why he hasn't been called up more either. But I also wouldn't mind seeing Mix in that role too. Bottom line is we need a creative influence next to bradley who serves as a mesh between destroyer and engine, and someone in the back whoever that might be, Jones Edu etc, so long as it works.

Rey Regicide
Post #100
Thursday September 12, 2013 4:54pm

Joined Sep 2013
Total Posts: 146
Original post from rainORshine

this IS something we have seen. we have seen edu fill that role behind bradley and jones 4 times, williams twice and beckerman once

most people thought adding a CDM to bradley/jones was a bad idea and it proved to be a bad idea.

what we have not seen is jones as a 6 (CDM) and pairing kljestan with bradley in the center of the field

in this scenario jones would offensively drop between CBs (as he did occasionally against mexico) to help distribute to bradley and kljestan from back and at times send long diagonal balls forward, which he is pretty proficient at

in current set-up bradley provides primary outlet for CBs while jones clears UP the field - where he is essentially useless


But def agree in your assessment of the CDM in that role of the 4 3 3. Have like a variable formation almost, linking the def to Bradley and Kljes or Mix who in turn link to Donovan and Altidore and co.

richieJkulesaNY
Post #101
Thursday September 12, 2013 5:02pm

Joined Jun 2012
Total Posts: 880
We cannot play a 4-3-3. Get over it. Our CMs are far too similar.

Rey Regicide
Post #102
Thursday September 12, 2013 5:02pm

Joined Sep 2013
Total Posts: 146
Original post from rainORshine

finding the right partner for MB in a 4-4-2 is not the ONLY possibility

yes, we have seen a 4-3-3 but one thing we have not seen is jones playing a 6 and bradley partnered with the likes of kljestan or diskerud in an "inverted triangle"

for instance:

-bradley-kljestan-
---jones---

guys like edu, beckerman and williams also candidates for the 6 role

offensively, drop the 6 onto the back line - allowing OBs to provide primary width, while guys like LD, dempsey and AJ (pick 2) support attack behind jozy - free attacking roles that i think all 3 could thrive on


I'm so sorry I didn't get to read this beforehand, I apologize

rainORshine
Post #103
Thursday September 12, 2013 5:17pm

Joined Dec 2012
Total Posts: 1,768
Original post from richieJkulesaNY

We cannot play a 4-3-3. Get over it. Our CMs are far too similar.


EVERYONE knew that playing a combination (3) of bradley, jones, beckerman, edu and williams was a terrible idea.

that is hardly evidence that we can not play a 4-3-3

richieJkulesaNY
Post #104
Thursday September 12, 2013 5:39pm

Joined Jun 2012
Total Posts: 880
Original post from rainORshine

EVERYONE knew that playing a combination (3) of bradley, jones, beckerman, edu and williams was a terrible idea.

that is hardly evidence that we can not play a 4-3-3


Kljestan is too similar to Jones & Bradley. I understand you want Jones to play the 6 role, but he doesnt play that role EVER, for anyone. Jones is good when he can go box to box. He's also an extremely reckless tackler. While he has been disciplined as of late, putting him that role is too risky.

Whether one is more defensive or offensive minded then the other, Kljestan, Jones, & Bradley are just too similar in their styles of play. It will create a clusterf*** in the midfield like we have seen over and over.

The only other CM you could possibly play with Jones and Bradley, whcih both would still be playing in a double pivot role, would be Mix as a CAM. We saw it against Bosnia and there were some flashes of good play there.

Rey Regicide
Post #105
Thursday September 12, 2013 6:02pm

Joined Sep 2013
Total Posts: 146
Original post from richieJkulesaNY

Kljestan is too similar to Jones & Bradley. I understand you want Jones to play the 6 role, but he doesnt play that role EVER, for anyone. Jones is good when he can go box to box. He's also an extremely reckless tackler. While he has been disciplined as of late, putting him that role is too risky.

Whether one is more defensive or offensive minded then the other, Kljestan, Jones, & Bradley are just too similar in their styles of play. It will create a clusterf*** in the midfield like we have seen over and over.

The only other CM you could possibly play with Jones and Bradley, whcih both would still be playing in a double pivot role, would be Mix as a CAM. We saw it against Bosnia and there were some flashes of good play there.


And we saw that against Mexico when we were in the 4 3 3 With Diskerud in the midfield, on top, of beckerman and jones who weren't necesssarily on the same level (distance up the pitch) And we didn't look good when Dempsey was "playing" there. Which of course he wasn't, offering no outlet for Jones or Beckerman's passes.

I guess its just semantics, but what in reality is the difference between a 4 2 1 3 or a 4 2 3 1? This 4 2 3 1 we speak of requires someone being withdrawn from the forward line, doesn't that become a 3 in the middle at some point?? Seems like Bedoya was pinned so far up and to the sides and didn't get involved much in the middle of the park unless it was to defend, which he did well.

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