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rainORshine
Post #1
Sunday June 30, 2013 8:24pm

Joined Dec 2012
Total Posts: 1,783
i was going to reply to "CONCACAF suckatude" thread, but thought this deserves its own thread...

yes, concacaf sucks and it is not getting better and it is not going to get better. beyond US and mexico it is basically small countries with limited resources... and the US is not going to improve by playing these teams over and over every cycle

for me, biggest development for USMNT would be participating in Copa America every cycle.

before that happens, CONMEBOL needs to get their shit together and (i think) make this a quadrennial event (like UEFA). not sure what those clowns are doing - when it is held at random intervals like it has been people tend to tune out.

there is no reason that Copa America could not be a legit #3 international tournament behind WC and Euros. i think you could argue that right now Confed Cup holds that spot. a true copa america with the 10 S. American teams and 6 hex teams every 4 years benefits both federations. my sense is that CONCACAF, not CONMEBOL, is keeping this from happening. fact is US is invited to play in CA every cycle, but rarely accepts invitation

US will only improve significantly when it becomes a larger part of the culture. that will only happen when americans see US winning important, meaningful games. as of now, only time that can happen is every 4 years at WC. you cant keep trying to sell people on the idea that "CONCACAF is improving" when the results are the same cycle after cycle.

UEFA teams are pulling away from the rest of the world because they are basically always involved in either WC or Euro cycles - constantly being challenged at the highest levels

honestly it is hard to figure how this has not happened yet. really makes you wonder what is happening at the top of USSF.

and, yes I realize that what i just described is what is in the works for 2016 - hopefully becomes a permanent fixture

Fraser31
Charleston, South Carolina
Post #2
Sunday June 30, 2013 8:43pm

Joined Sep 2012
Total Posts: 1,012
Couldn't agree more. South American teams are absolute quality, the same kind that we need to propel forward as a soccer nation. Good post.

admsghs27
Post #3
Sunday June 30, 2013 9:05pm

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 3,298
I been saying it for years,.and combebol has invited us various times but ussoccer declines the invitation, damm gulati.. well copa Americas is gonna be in USA in 2015 I believe.. 16 teams.

rainORshine
Post #4
Sunday June 30, 2013 10:30pm

Joined Dec 2012
Total Posts: 1,783
Original post from admsghs27

I been saying it for years,.and combebol has invited us various times but ussoccer declines the invitation, damm gulati.. well copa Americas is gonna be in USA in 2015 I believe.. 16 teams.


2016 - if it comes off. still awaiting FIFA approval. this will be a "special" centennial edition of the tournament.

there is a CA regularly scheduled for 2015 - mexico is participating, as they do regularly, and then again in 2019

as of 2011 is was decided that the "regular" version would be held every 4 years in year after WC - but they are already randomly throwing in this "bonus" edition - which just further undermines the credibility of the tournament

nolefansandy
Post #5
Sunday June 30, 2013 10:54pm

Joined Jul 2012
Total Posts: 281
Honduras and Costa Rica are improving rapidly with us. Concacaf sucks agreed but as the MLS grows so will Concacaf. Jamaica has very talented players, their federation and coaching screwed up. The US needs to participate in the Copa America but Concacaf is very slowly getting better. As Soccer in America grows so shall Concacaf.

Jzaval01
Post #6
Monday July 1, 2013 1:24am

Joined May 2013
Total Posts: 1,637
You guys think Jurgen will accept the next call up for Copa America? I think so knowing how Jurgen like to challenge the team.

MSantoine
Post #7
Monday July 1, 2013 2:41am

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 2,205
This again comes down to money. The Euros have a pretty big tv deal. The gold cup has nothing. The UEFA tv deal makes all nations (even those like Latvia and Bulgaria) get money to spend on infrastructure and national leagues. If gold cup had a good tv deal it would help those smaller countries become better. Since thats not going to happen we need to get the Copa and hope ESPN, NBC, & Fox Soccer all bid for it and create more money for all

Know Nothing
Post #8
Monday July 1, 2013 3:50pm

Joined Jan 2013
Total Posts: 386
If invited it makes sense to participate, but would it not make more sense to boost CONCACAF as a whole as well?

CONCACAF has one too many Gold Cups...Perhaps instead of the extra Gold Cup we can join with COMNEBOL to create a "Tournament of the Americas" every 4 years.

In addition, perhaps do the same on the Youth International level, only make the tournaments more frequent.

Kamphgruppe
Michigan
Post #9
Monday July 1, 2013 3:59pm

Joined Jul 2012
Total Posts: 280
Original post from rainORshine
yes, concacaf sucks and it is not getting better and it is not going to get better. beyond US and mexico it is basically small countries with limited resources... and the US is not going to improve by playing these teams over and over every cycle


I like the idea of the US attending the CA tournament with our A team as often as possible. However, I have to disagree with you on Concacaf. It is getting better and continues to do so.

rainORshine
Post #10
Monday July 1, 2013 4:03pm

Joined Dec 2012
Total Posts: 1,783
Original post from MSantoine

This again comes down to money. The Euros have a pretty big tv deal. The gold cup has nothing. The UEFA tv deal makes all nations (even those like Latvia and Bulgaria) get money to spend on infrastructure and national leagues. If gold cup had a good tv deal it would help those smaller countries become better. Since thats not going to happen we need to get the Copa and hope ESPN, NBC, & Fox Soccer all bid for it and create more money for all


gold cup will never generate much interest - so it will never have a great tv deal. only die-hard fans care about gold cup and that will not change

a 16-team north/south CA could generate pretty massive interest in US, mexico, central america (and s america) and more interest from around the world than it currently does. one of those networks would jump all over that and ultimately would be a boon for every nation in both confederations

i dont really see a drawback (you can still keep the gold cup, but probably only every 4 years)

MSantoine
Post #11
Monday July 1, 2013 4:26pm

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 2,205
Original post from rainORshine

gold cup will never generate much interest - so it will never have a great tv deal. only die-hard fans care about gold cup and that will not change

a 16-team north/south CA could generate pretty massive interest in US, mexico, central america (and s america) and more interest from around the world than it currently does. one of those networks would jump all over that and ultimately would be a boon for every nation in both confederations

i dont really see a drawback (you can still keep the gold cup, but probably only every 4 years)


I love this idea. It could work as follows:

Year 1 after a World Cup we have a CA with everyone. Top NA & top SA team qualify for Confed Cup (the qualifying rounds would in theory give every nation a shot). Then the year before the cup, ie Confed Cup year (like this) we would have our NA only Gold Cup. They could change the WQ formatting to move some of the games around and have no qualies in June to have the gold cup instead so only the Confed representative is at a disadvantage.

Know Nothing
Post #12
Monday July 1, 2013 6:55pm

Joined Jan 2013
Total Posts: 386
Makes sense, a 16 team tournament with 8 teams from each region. Stipulate all the teams from the previous WC automatically qualify, so the remaining 4 CONCACAF reps would be determined by qualifiers, as would the remaining three COMNEBOL teams (they do get 5 WC reps, don't they?).

rainORshine
Post #13
Monday July 1, 2013 8:38pm

Joined Dec 2012
Total Posts: 1,783
all technicalities i suppose but i would think about following:

- CA year after WC - all 10 SA nations + 6 NA - you could just use WCQ from previous cycle as qualifying (so 6 Hex teams). i dont think you really want to worry about going beyond 6 NA teams and then you also dont have to worry about more qualifying in either region

- I would then actually think about moving GC to the even year b/t WCs - and keep GC as Confed Cup qualifier to keep it somewhat relevant (otherwise there is almost not point to it)

you could also possibly have the best finishing team in CA play GC winner in play-off for Confed

- World Cup
- Copa America
- Gold Cup / (Euros)
- Confederations

probably biggest issue for USSF is overextending the players - you just cant ask guys to play every summer so you would have to probably rotate different guys through the various tournaments and would be tricky to prioritize


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