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MSantoine
Post #16
Monday April 15, 2013 3:10pm

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 2,184
Original post from dolcem

Democratically run clubs are a great idea. Electing the GM is not a good idea but even so it's nothing compared to having the fans pick the lineup. That is literally the stupidest idea I have ever read on the internet and I can't take anyone seriously who believes in it.

What kind of a coach would want to come to the US if you had a bunch of ignorant fans telling him how to run the team?

When one person within the club, such as an owner or technical director (who are actually knowledgeable) interferes with the manager it's a huge problem. It results in the players losing confidence in the manager or the manager just quitting. In soccer a manager has to have 100% control of the team for it to work. But I'm not going to write the 1000 other reasons it's a terrible idea because it's a waste of everyone's time.

This will never happen ANYWHERE.


Seattle has been a great model of success for the MLS since their inception. Clearly they are doing some things right. Being a Revs fan (the anti-Seattle) i was just curious if those close to Seattle like the method or not. You not being from Seattle have as much to argue for or against it as I do.

dolcem
Post #17
Tuesday April 16, 2013 9:21am

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 1,045
Original post from MSantoine

Seattle has been a great model of success for the MLS since their inception. Clearly they are doing some things right. Being a Revs fan (the anti-Seattle) i was just curious if those close to Seattle like the method or not. You not being from Seattle have as much to argue for or against it as I do.


I am originally from Seattle, and I really do like the way the Sounders are run. In many countries the clubs are democratically run (not in England) and it's great. Selecting the GM by popular election IMO is fan micromanagement...they should elect the ownership, which in turn has control over all aspects of the team. But it's a good idea at heart.

Having the fans pick the line-ups, however, is just not worth responding to. When people new to soccer come up with ideas like getting rid of ties, changing the size of the goals, getting rid of the offisde rule, etc. it's best to just ignore them.
NO ONE GIVES A SHIT ABOUT WHAT LINEUP YOU USE IN FIFA
rainORshine
Post #18
Monday April 29, 2013 2:22am

Joined Dec 2012
Total Posts: 1,773
would love to see LD move into a "free" role underneath altidore / dempsey - finding space side to side

----altidore--dempsey----
-------donovan-------
---bradley-kljestan-jones---
johnson-boca-gonzo-chandler

** this is basically dolcems diamond

or

------altidore--dempsey------
---------donovan---------
-------bradley--jones-------
johnson-------------chandler
-----besler-boca-cameron----

SoccerGod
Clouds, Heaven
Post #19
Monday April 29, 2013 5:13am

Joined Apr 2013
Total Posts: 84
Original post from rainORshine

would love to see LD move into a "free" role underneath altidore / dempsey - finding space side to side

--altidore-dempsey--
----donovan----
--bradley-kljestan-jones--
johnson-boca-gonzo-chandler

** this is basically dolcems diamond

or

---altidore-dempsey---
-----donovan-----
----bradley-jones----
johnson-------chandler
---besler-boca-cameron--


I really like the 1st one. I'd be very happy seeing that one in the upcoming qualifiers. The 2nd one I don't like at all, but I can understand why some people would want it.
For I am creator of all things soccer. Seek repentance or just beat Mexico, either will get you in up here.
blaise213
San Francisco CA
Post #20
Monday April 29, 2013 5:22am

Joined Sep 2012
Total Posts: 1,347
Original post from rainORshine

would love to see LD move into a "free" role underneath altidore / dempsey - finding space side to side

-altidore-dempsey-
--donovan--
-bradley-kljestan-jones-
johnson-boca-gonzo-chandler

** this is basically dolcems diamond

or

--altidore-dempsey--
---donovan---
--bradley-jones--
johnson----chandler
--besler-boca-cameron-


(maybe Fabian) but there's not one player in those line-ups that has ball possession skills and would try to take on a defender 1 vs 1

God I cant wait for the U-20 kids to be on the senior team.

rainORshine
Post #21
Monday April 29, 2013 4:04pm

Joined Dec 2012
Total Posts: 1,773
Original post from SoccerGod

I really like the 1st one. I'd be very happy seeing that one in the upcoming qualifiers. The 2nd one I don't like at all, but I can understand why some people would want it.


i am leaning towards that one myself

the big issue is width, but offensively i would essentially have LD look for space wide on either side, then have opposite side outside back push forward for width on that side. LD would basically play a "totti" role

i suppose big personnel decisions at this point would be:

boca v besler - i am sticking with boca for now, but happy to see besler get opportunities to see what he has got

chandler v dolo - people seem down on chandler, but he has proven his value at nurnburg and dolo has been struggling with injury and will be 35 in feb. i think you have got to give TC every opportunity. if it looks like he is not up for it, you always have dolo (or cameron) to fall back on

kljestan v torres - obviously i prefer SK, but i would be happy to see torres get equal opportunity in that deep-lying playmaking role, flanked by bradley and jones

dolcem
Post #22
Monday April 29, 2013 7:45pm

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 1,045
Original post from rainORshine

would love to see LD move into a "free" role underneath altidore / dempsey - finding space side to side

--altidore-dempsey--
----donovan----
--bradley-kljestan-jones--
johnson-boca-gonzo-chandler

** this is basically dolcems diamond

or

---altidore-dempsey---
-----donovan-----
----bradley-jones----
johnson-------chandler
---besler-boca-cameron--


They're basically the same formation except in the top one you have a DM instead of a third CB. I'd prefer the DM because that would mean more numbers in midfield (where we are losing battles, especially possession). If this DM were to be Klejstan or especially Torres, this would be great for maintaining possession and stringing a few passes together. I'd rather see either player played as one of the CM's with a destroyer (Jones, Bradley, etc.) playing as the DM but that's just me.

The problem is though that I don't see Donovan as a #10 type at all. Under Coach Bob when we he played as the CAM in the 4-5-1 he would always disappear for long periods of time (something the #10 cannot do, if there's a #10 hei has to play well; if he doesn't, the team cannot attack effectively). He's just not a good enough distributor. He was always a winger/withdrawn forward, and he produced much better for us after he was moved out to the wing.

If we play with one of these formations I'd rather see Dempsey play that role and for Donovan to come on as a sub for Gomez or Altidore. With Donovan's age rapidly catching up to him (and his pace was always his biggest asset, which is a problem since he's in the MLS and won't be forced to adapt his game as he slows down) I think he's most effective off the bench. He won't have to conserve his energy, he'll be able to run at tired defenses, and he'll have his energy when we need him most (he's a clutch player). Is Dempsey a #10? No. But he's probably the closest thing we've ever had aside from Adu. And even if that miracle happens, he won't be a starter. Apparently Corona is sort of a #10 but I do not think he is dominant enough of a player for us to play him there.

But I don't think either will work for the same reasons we really struggled playing with this formation in the past. Just not enough width or attacking prowess.

I think our best bet will be to pray that Shea gets PT at Stoke this upcoming season and use a 4-3-3:

Shea Altidore Dempsey
Torres Jones
Bradley
Johnson CB CB Chandler
Howard

If/when we fall behind, we can substitute Bradley or Jones for Donovan and move Dempsey into the middle to make it a 4-5-1 (more attacking players). When using a 4-3-3 we could probably use Gomez instead of Shea, but as we've seen Herc is not a natural winger that can play in a 4-5-1. An inside forward in a 4-3-3 maybe but not a winger.

I think Klinsmann is thinking the same thing more or less which is why he has switched to the 4-5-1. He does not want or intend on Zusi and Gomez starting on the wings in the WC, he is just waiting until Shea and Donovan come back into the fold. Makes sense to me.
NO ONE GIVES A SHIT ABOUT WHAT LINEUP YOU USE IN FIFA
Riggity
Atlanta
Post #23
Monday April 29, 2013 7:54pm

Joined Apr 2013
Total Posts: 66
You just want the fans to pick the last two spots so ya boy down in Brazil will finally get on the roster lol

Alcharod
302
Post #24
Monday April 29, 2013 8:59pm

Joined Dec 2012
Total Posts: 574
Original post from Riggity

You just want the fans to pick the last two spots so ya boy down in Brazil will finally get on the roster lol


Um yeaaaaa thats the jist of it..... Glad you do realize that if it were "up to the "Fans" he'd make the roster lol...#thinkbeforeyoutype lol...

rainORshine
Post #25
Monday April 29, 2013 9:01pm

Joined Dec 2012
Total Posts: 1,773
Original post from dolcem

I think Klinsmann is thinking the same thing more or less which is why he has switched to the 4-5-1. He does not want or intend on Zusi and Gomez starting on the wings in the WC, he is just waiting until Shea and Donovan come back into the fold. Makes sense to me.


so you think part of JKs plan at this point involves brek shea starting next summer?... and this makes sense to you?

the same brek shea that has 1 good season under his belt - his 2011 MLS campaign?

wow, i hope not. at this point you make a plan based on what you have in front of you and if something better comes along you adjust on the fly. you dont wait around for someone who has proven absolutely nothing.

not sure how that makes sense

dempsey is never going to play behind 2 forwards. he is a forward and he is our biggest goal-scoring threat. he wont be put that far from goal.

i think putting LD behind 2 forwards in a roving attacker position could suit him perfectly. would find space wide to create width. lately he has become more of a creator than scorer - 34 goals, 38 assists in MLS since 2010. but we wouldnt know until we try,,,

Riggity
Atlanta
Post #26
Monday April 29, 2013 10:00pm

Joined Apr 2013
Total Posts: 66
I thought plenty before that, I was illustrating how there is a large part of thr American fanbase that would vote for him(such as yourself) even thouh he has done nothing to deserve it. Because they remember him as a young prodigy not someone who has had a journeyman career the last decade. #wayoveryourhead...lol

Loche Achles
Post #27
Monday April 29, 2013 10:31pm

Joined Feb 2013
Total Posts: 270
Two things - no to players who aren't at least sort of playing for their teams (that includes Freddy wunderkind. He needs time to break in at Bahia and focus on that) on the rosters please

and

no hash tags, please.

Alcharod
302
Post #28
Monday April 29, 2013 11:26pm

Joined Dec 2012
Total Posts: 574
Original post from Riggity

I thought plenty before that, I was illustrating how there is a large part of thr American fanbase that would vote for him(such as yourself) even thouh he has done nothing to deserve it. Because they remember him as a young prodigy not someone who has had a journeyman career the last decade. #wayoveryourhead...lol


I def wont mess up the flow us the thread because things have been good for awhile. But i'll ask as I always do. Name one time he has not performed for the National team. Also thought you'd like to know that Adu, beat the first team subs of Bahia by himself in a scrimmage with the Reserve team 2-1. Adu both goals. Have a good one . O yea don't forget to let me know when he didn't perform for the Nats thanks!

dolcem
Post #29
Wednesday May 1, 2013 6:53pm

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 1,045
Original post from rainORshine

so you think part of JKs plan at this point involves brek shea starting next summer?... and this makes sense to you?

the same brek shea that has 1 good season under his belt - his 2011 MLS campaign?

wow, i hope not. at this point you make a plan based on what you have in front of you and if something better comes along you adjust on the fly. you dont wait around for someone who has proven absolutely nothing.

not sure how that makes sense

dempsey is never going to play behind 2 forwards. he is a forward and he is our biggest goal-scoring threat. he wont be put that far from goal.

i think putting LD behind 2 forwards in a roving attacker position could suit him perfectly. would find space wide to create width. lately he has become more of a creator than scorer - 34 goals, 38 assists in MLS since 2010. but we wouldnt know until we try,,,


It's not just Shea he's waiting for, it's Donovan and Corona as well.

We tried playing without wingers. We looked horrible. While I agree things could have been better with more creativity in the midfield, I don't think it's the solution to our problems and I don't find too much fault with Klinsmann for not sticking with it. It's very hard to attack well without wingers. Basically you need a really talented #10 and we don't have that.

So this means we have to play with two wingers. At the moment we don't have any. But Donovan will return at some point and Corona will probably get more minutes. Shea is also a possibility. So he's having us play with two wingers and then will replace Gomez and Zusi when we have players available.
NO ONE GIVES A SHIT ABOUT WHAT LINEUP YOU USE IN FIFA
admsghs27
Post #30
Wednesday May 1, 2013 9:37pm

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 3,161
Only if we had the players jk could implement the bayern/Dortmund tactics.. Thats some beutiful effective soccer.. Im sure he wants to do it but we just dont have the olayers/talent.

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