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Dimo
Post #91
Sunday January 26, 2014 10:01pm

Joined Nov 2013
Total Posts: 258
Great article! Only thing is that we don't know how Johannsson would do in a CAM position. I'm all for trying it out of course. The only other problem I saw with the formation is that Cameron isn't in it. Maybe movie fabian up to LM, Chandler to LB, and Cameron to RB?

Jzaval01
Post #92
Sunday January 26, 2014 10:26pm

Joined May 2013
Total Posts: 1,435
I thought we tried Chandler at LB and he didnt look that good?

rainORshine
Post #93
Sunday January 26, 2014 10:49pm

Joined Dec 2012
Total Posts: 1,770
Original post from richieJkulesaNY

Formations are not tactics.

This is a very good read if you guys get the chance...

http://americansoccernow.com/articles/double-...


their suggested formation puts all 4 of jozy, AJ, LD and dempsey on the pitch. 3 would be a stretch (with donovan on a wing)

thats 4 guys who are ideally suited to central attacking positions. and AJ is a pure 18-yard box striker. you have to play him in that position or not play him at all

have a hard time seeing that work out too well

navi8132
Post #94
Sunday January 26, 2014 11:38pm

Joined Jul 2012
Total Posts: 1,903
We have seen what happens when AronJ is playing in the CAM position for bits of his games with us. It was marked by awkward decision making and here and there a clever well executed pass. Don't put him there just to get him on the field. Best team doesn't equal best players.

2tone
Ten-Towns
Post #95
Sunday January 26, 2014 11:59pm

Joined Jul 2012
Total Posts: 4,917
AJ a pure 18 yard box striker? Hmm, he is much more than that.

rainORshine
Post #96
Monday January 27, 2014 12:29am

Joined Dec 2012
Total Posts: 1,770
?

AJ is a 9, a striker, a finisher, at top of AZ 4-3-3 no? this is a debate?

richieJkulesaNY
Post #97
Monday January 27, 2014 4:17pm

Joined Jun 2012
Total Posts: 932
Original post from rainORshine

their suggested formation puts all 4 of jozy, AJ, LD and dempsey on the pitch. 3 would be a stretch (with donovan on a wing)

thats 4 guys who are ideally suited to central attacking positions. and AJ is a pure 18-yard box striker. you have to play him in that position or not play him at all

have a hard time seeing that work out too well


The real point is if you want our fullbacks to help in the attack, you dont have to change the formation to do so. Obviously who we want to plug in at each position can be debated until the end of time.

Also, you need guys who can play centrally to open the wings up for the fullbacks to play into. So that should factor into who you want to start on the wing.

ktbffhTXac
Post #98
Monday January 27, 2014 4:44pm

Joined Dec 2012
Total Posts: 124
Original post from joey11

I guess I'm in the minority when I say I really don't care if Chandler returns. Yes he is a good player but he's "screwed" the NT over and over. If I were a teammate I'd worry once in Brazil he may decide to pull out because too much flying or something. No I don't think Evens is better but more reliable.

Did I miss something? What is Dolo's status? Is he totally out of WC consideration? Haven't heard much about him. I thought he was back playing again.


Chandler was hurt for the better part of 2013 so it's not like he intentionally screwed the national team over. It's pretty much common knowledge that he and JK decided it was best that he get healthy and regain his form with Nuremburg so that he could be in a better position to challenge for a spot in Brazil. He's on record saying that he truly wants to play for the US in Brazil and flying will not be an issue.

As far as Dolo is concerned, it seems that he's out of WC consideration at this point since he's still having a lot of trouble with his knee. It's a shame too because his veteran leadership on the back line (whether he was in the starting XI or not) would be huge for us.

rainORshine
Post #99
Monday January 27, 2014 4:55pm

Joined Dec 2012
Total Posts: 1,770
Original post from richieJkulesaNY

The real point is if you want our fullbacks to help in the attack, you dont have to change the formation to do so. Obviously who we want to plug in at each position can be debated until the end of time.

Also, you need guys who can play centrally to open the wings up for the fullbacks to play into. So that should factor into who you want to start on the wing.


i think the "double pivot" with dempsey on a wing, combined with trying to get width/attacking from your OBs is a disaster... just leaves you too exposed at times

i would argue that however you arrange the back line, it will likely get shredded in WC without a dedicated 6 AND other competent 2 way players to help defend wings . so i disagree that you can effectively get OBs forward in that formation

if you watch what happens in friendlies even against modest competition... we get exposed in the gaps that form between CBs and bradley / jones - they just have not really figured it out

take jones out, plug that hole with d. williams and now bradley has the run of the park

aside from that, you do need some defensive coverage on the wings and i just cant see dempsey effectively getting up and down that left wing for 90 mins anymore

williams and jones are both essentially ex-bundesliga players at this point. williams is improving month to month, battling for EPL promotion. jones? who knows

if nothing else, williams holding underneath bradley is a formation change that vastly improves balance of entire team

rainORshine
Post #100
Monday January 27, 2014 5:18pm

Joined Dec 2012
Total Posts: 1,770
if sticking with back 4 and 2 CMs...

------altidore---------
----------donovan-----
fabian----bradley---chandler
--------williams--------
lichaj-goodson-gonzo-cameron

the point is that YES fabian and chandler are and always have been (this cycle) our best weapons on the wings

i think it is absolutely dreaming to think we could get them forward to much effect from OB spots against the competition we will be facing - there will be a LOT of defending to do... which is why id send them up to WB spots

if not that, then why not send both up to MF spots instead of clogging up the offensive third with a bunch of guys who ideally want to get in/around the 18?...

ktbffhTXac
Post #101
Monday January 27, 2014 5:51pm

Joined Dec 2012
Total Posts: 124
Original post from rainORshine

if sticking with back 4 and 2 CMs...

---altidore-----
-----donovan---
fabian--bradley--chandler
----williams----
lichaj-goodson-gonzo-cameron

the point is that YES fabian and chandler are and always have been (this cycle) our best weapons on the wings

i think it is absolutely dreaming to think we could get them forward to much effect from OB spots against the competition we will be facing - there will be a LOT of defending to do... which is why id send them up to WB spots

if not that, then why not send both up to MF spots instead of clogging up the offensive third with a bunch of guys who ideally want to get in/around the 18?...


Surprisingly enough, I actually agree with this formation against Germany and Portugale (save for Goodson who I'd replace with Besler).

Dimo
Post #102
Monday January 27, 2014 5:59pm

Joined Nov 2013
Total Posts: 258
Original post from rainORshine

if sticking with back 4 and 2 CMs...

---altidore-----
-----donovan---
fabian--bradley--chandler
----williams----
lichaj-goodson-gonzo-cameron

the point is that YES fabian and chandler are and always have been (this cycle) our best weapons on the wings

i think it is absolutely dreaming to think we could get them forward to much effect from OB spots against the competition we will be facing - there will be a LOT of defending to do... which is why id send them up to WB spots

if not that, then why not send both up to MF spots instead of clogging up the offensive third with a bunch of guys who ideally want to get in/around the 18?...


I've been liking most of your posts lately but this won't happen m8. Firstly, you can't throw in a totally new squad for the wc. Lichaj, Williams, Chandler, and Goodson have barely played for the USMNT. Secondly, those CB's will get torn to shreds in the wc. Imagine that lack of pace + Gonzo's error prone self against Ghana. Besler is probably the only lock we have at CB. I like the IDEA of Fabian and to a lesser extent, Chandler on the wings. But in reality we don't have the OB's to allow that to happen. You're worried about Dempsey's lack of pace to play on the wing. But with our best players in, we have a higher chance of possessing more of the ball. Plus, him cutting in gives Fabian room on the wing. I also think that being his last world cup, he will bust his ass to get up and down the field to help on defense. Clint is at his best when he is making that third run into the box. We should try him on the left. Give the middle spot to Landon. Or play a 4-4-1-1 with Johannsson in the CF spot.

MSantoine
Post #103
Monday January 27, 2014 6:00pm

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 2,110
Original post from rainORshine

if sticking with back 4 and 2 CMs...

---altidore-----
-----donovan---
fabian--bradley--chandler
----williams----
lichaj-goodson-gonzo-cameron

the point is that YES fabian and chandler are and always have been (this cycle) our best weapons on the wings

i think it is absolutely dreaming to think we could get them forward to much effect from OB spots against the competition we will be facing - there will be a LOT of defending to do... which is why id send them up to WB spots

if not that, then why not send both up to MF spots instead of clogging up the offensive third with a bunch of guys who ideally want to get in/around the 18?...


That is a huge point that a lot of people overlook. I know we've grown and have arguably the most talent on our roster but we arent on Germany and Portugal's level (I think we can take it to Ghana but thats a different debate). Id actuallt take your lineup one step further and go with something like this:

Jozy
Clint (or LD but I think Clint will show hes still our #1)
Fab-Bradley-Yedlin
Williams (or Jones)
Chandler-Besler-OG (or Brooks/Goodson)-Cam

Also could stick with Lichaj at LB, put Chandler at RB and kick Cam inside next to Besler. This puts 6 mostly defenders in our linsup which should help out when Germany/Portugal are dominating position. It also allows the fullbacks to make runs while the wings cover at times to provide a stronger counter attack. Yedlin and Fab could easily drop back into defense while Chandler, Cameron, Lichaj all know how to make runs when the time is right (Cameron has gotten much better the last 10 weeks or so for Stoke).

rainORshine
Post #104
Monday January 27, 2014 6:28pm

Joined Dec 2012
Total Posts: 1,770
with dempsey

-----jozy-------
------dempsey---
fab----MB--donovan
-----williams-----
chandler-X-X-cameron

this is more or less what JK has hinted at, with the exceptions of williams for jones and chandler at LB

Dimo
Post #105
Monday January 27, 2014 6:34pm

Joined Nov 2013
Total Posts: 258
Original post from rainORshine

with dempsey

---jozy----
---dempsey--
fab--MB-donovan
---williams---
chandler-X-X-cameron

this is more or less what JK has hinted at, with the exceptions of williams for jones and chandler at LB


Can you imagine how strong we would look with a good pair of CB's?

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