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Which player scored the most impressive goal over the weekend?
Josh Sargent (Werder Bremen)
Haji Wright (SonderjyskE)
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Tyler Boyd (Besiktas)
Julian Green (Greuther Furth)
Nicholas Gioacchini (Caen)
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Samtom23
Post #1
Friday August 14, 2020 10:29pm

Joined Jun 2018
Total Posts: 426
MLS has started to get it right with youth and starting to target young foreign players. But it's pay structure makes it hard to bring more players with pedigree and then retaining them. Also, it was having a problem of playing players with big contracts. It is getting away from this but a real test of this will be with Toronto with Jozy and Akinola.

But we have seen Tyler Adams, Alphonso Davies do well in the Champions League this past week. Not afflaited with MLS but USA, Weston and CP. I believe other players and teams (last year's Atlanta and LAFC) could not win immediately but acquit themselves against their European counterparts. They then would have the revenue to sustain and develop. Also, bringing in Championship teams and playing in an actual competitive match would be huge for US Soccer and MLS.

The way to gain credibility internationally and raise players salaries is via the Champions League. The best way to do this is Inter Miami and David Beckham in my opinion. We saw this past week Inter Miami bring in Blaise Matudo in a cut rate deal. But if not via Beckham then by some ownership that has vision and credibility. But I would target Inter Miami because of Beckham and his connections. But any other thoughts on this idea?

BG6
Post #2
Saturday August 15, 2020 12:12am

Joined May 2014
Total Posts: 93
This post is completely incoherent, no idea whatsoever what you are suggesting in the last paragraph.

Samtom23
Post #3
Saturday August 15, 2020 12:23am

Joined Jun 2018
Total Posts: 426
Original post from BG6

This post is completely incoherent, no idea whatsoever what you are suggesting in the last paragraph.


Apologies, I was up watching Barca and Bayern and only two hours of sleep. Just had a cup of coffee and it helps definitely not sharp at the moment.

I was trying to figure out a way to make it possible. I would think it would have to come from MLS ownership making an overture to the Champions League. As I am aware, of MLS ownership the only one that has any links to the Champions League is David Beckham. Also, he has credibility in Europe. I do hope this clarifies it somewhat.

And yeah, I am exhausted so please forgive the incoherent representation of my thought. I have to look forward to playing with three year old kid when she wakes up in a few moments and that is tough when you are this tired.

BG6
Post #4
Saturday August 15, 2020 10:45am

Joined May 2014
Total Posts: 93
I still don't understand. Making overtures tot he champions league? You do realize it is not a separate governing body right? Uefa runs the champions league. Not sure what you expect Beckham to do, bat his big blue eyes and they let us in? That probably won't be enough for uefa to suddenly say let's dilute the quality of the competition and take away slots from one of our member nations for a team from the USA. How would it work anyway, teams traveling midweek back and forth across the ocean when the MLS is winding down or ramping up for weaker competition. Imagine Dynomo Kiev having to go to LA, that's 13 hours on a plane.

Also why do you think MLS clubs would do well? Have you ever been to matches in Europe and watched them in person? TV does not do it justice. I have said it here before you cannot judge from watching on TV there is much more to the game than what is shown. I am regularly in Europe for work and attend matches every time I go. Most are in the secondary leagues MLS is often compared to in terms of quality.

The pace of play is much faster for the top clubs (even in secondary leagues) than for MLS. I know people often say MLS is on par with this league or that league but reality is the top clubs in those secondary leagues are still much better. Do you really think MLS clubs have a shot at beating the Benfica's, the Basel's, the Ajax's to which so many compare the quality of our league with theirs? (Perhaps overall too to bottom on average MLS can compare but not to the top teams in them). I am sorry I would be shocked if MLS teams would consistently earn even 3 points in the group stage.

I would also say this I am a proud season ticket holder for MLS club since 1996. This is not hating on MLS, I enjoy attending MLS games (albeit not as much as the ones I got to in Europe). Sorry the success of a few players in Europe in champions league does not mean we can compete. I don't know why everyone has to always compare. MLS should simply embrace an identity trying to grow as a feeder league for very young players. It can still be exciting and good for the sport in our country to have a league which develop players from North America to move to further develop themselves. It doesn't mean MLS doesn't have players worthy of the national team nor does it mean we need to have an inferiority complex because the best teams are in Europe and South America.

I simply do not understand this obsession with comparing.

bjelks
Post #5
Saturday August 15, 2020 1:32pm

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 1,694
According to globalfootballrankimgs.com, mls would be be behind China, Denmark, and Greece in average team value and quality of play.

Davies and Tyler were teen phenoms. Almiron was already a starter on a team that won the Argentine Superliga. Yedlin was arguably the best athlete in the league at 19.
Those guys are anomalies and not the mean.

If we want to raise the value of mls, we need pro/ rel, competitive games against Copa Lib teams and maybe some sort of challenge games or glorified friendlies against Championship teams. As of now, mls needs to start smacking Mexican teams and winning CCL.
goalsense
Samtom23
Post #6
Saturday August 15, 2020 3:16pm

Joined Jun 2018
Total Posts: 426
Original post from bjelks

According to globalfootballrankimgs.com, mls would be be behind China, Denmark, and Greece in average team value and quality of play.

Davies and Tyler were teen phenoms. Almiron was already a starter on a team that won the Argentine Superliga. Yedlin was arguably the best athlete in the league at 19.
Those guys are anomalies and not the mean.

If we want to raise the value of mls, we need pro/ rel, competitive games against Copa Lib teams and maybe some sort of challenge games or glorified friendlies against Championship teams. As of now, mls needs to start smacking Mexican teams and winning CCL.


Bjelks, you are a racist homophobic twit that listens to a former youth coach as a source of knowledge. I can safely call you an imbecile.

Further, if global rankings told you 2+2=5. You spew it up here a week later. You are cognitively challenged in more ways than I thought possible.

So in conclusion, why waste my time on a racist homophobic moron?

Samtom23
Post #7
Saturday August 15, 2020 6:37pm

Joined Jun 2018
Total Posts: 426
Original post from BG6

I still don't understand. Making overtures tot he champions league? You do realize it is not a separate governing body right? Uefa runs the champions league. Not sure what you expect Beckham to do, bat his big blue eyes and they let us in? That probably won't be enough for uefa to suddenly say let's dilute the quality of the competition and take away slots from one of our member nations for a team from the USA. How would it work anyway, teams traveling midweek back and forth across the ocean when the MLS is winding down or ramping up for weaker competition. Imagine Dynomo Kiev having to go to LA, that's 13 hours on a plane.

Also why do you think MLS clubs would do well? Have you ever been to matches in Europe and watched them in person? TV does not do it justice. I have said it here before you cannot judge from watching on TV there is much more to the game than what is shown. I am regularly in Europe for work and attend matches every time I go. Most are in the secondary leagues MLS is often compared to in terms of quality.

The pace of play is much faster for the top clubs (even in secondary leagues) than for MLS. I know people often say MLS is on par with this league or that league but reality is the top clubs in those secondary leagues are still much better. Do you really think MLS clubs have a shot at beating the Benfica's, the Basel's, the Ajax's to which so many compare the quality of our league with theirs? (Perhaps overall too to bottom on average MLS can compare but not to the top teams in them). I am sorry I would be shocked if MLS teams would consistently earn even 3 points in the group stage.

I would also say this I am a proud season ticket holder for MLS club since 1996. This is not hating on MLS, I enjoy attending MLS games (albeit not as much as the ones I got to in Europe). Sorry the success of a few players in Europe in champions league does not mean we can compete. I don't know why everyone has to always compare. MLS should simply embrace an identity trying to grow as a feeder league for very young players. It can still be exciting and good for the sport in our country to have a league which develop players from North America to move to further develop themselves. It doesn't mean MLS doesn't have players worthy of the national team nor does it mean we need to have an inferiority complex because the best teams are in Europe and South America.

I simply do not understand this obsession with comparing.


This is purely hypothetical.

I was listening to Weah this past week on a podcast that talking about many things but one of those was raising the standard of soccer in USA. He believed it would come by winning the World Cup. I agree partly.

Now watching the Champions League and seeing players associated with USA and not just MLS doing well on this platform was nice to see.

But it seemed in this world sport, USA doesn't have any avenue to actually compete annually. Related to MLS is how the league has a credibility problem and a pay problem. I assume MLS would not do well initially but just needed is to initially to make a decent showing. But as teams got money from appearing the competition would increase as they kept and acquired players.

Travel is still a huge problem but there are sub supersonic flights available from London to New York making it a five hour trip. Still lots of problems logistically speaking.

As far as, different organizing bodies. I think because money involved would affect this. And only mentioned Beckham because he has existing relations on both sides. It could be someone else or a group.

Not trying to compare leagues but trying to think of ways to lift ithe sport in USA more so. It just happens it would affect MLS positively. And I challenge the notion it should only be a feeder league for young players. If MLS moves beyond that it would be good for all parties

bjelks
Post #8
Sunday August 16, 2020 6:14pm

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 1,694
I told you how to lift the sport in America: pro/ rel, beat liga mex teams consistently, beat South American teams in competitive games, that's it.
It's simple.
goalsense
Kamphgruppe
Michigan
Post #9
Sunday August 16, 2020 7:47pm

Joined Jul 2012
Total Posts: 1,018
Original post from bjelks

I told you how to lift the sport in America: pro/ rel, beat liga mex teams consistently, beat South American teams in competitive games, that's it.
It's simple.


It really boils down to money. So many European teams go broke due to pro/rel. It's not a good business model and there is no way someone in the US wants to buy a team that has no chance to make money. We will win vs the Mex teams when we have enough money to have quality players on the bench, not just starters. MLS is getting closer and closer to this as every new TV contract has lead to lager salaries for players and more money to spend on DP's etc. No matter what you think about the level of the league, it continues to grow and it's fanbase continues to grow and the TV contracts continue to grow. We will eventually have enough money to field teams that can win Concacaf champions league. I would love to have some competition with South American clubs, maybe a combined Champions league is the answer. I like all the pairing up were doing with Liga MX. Hopefully it will be beneficial to both leagues.

Samtom23
Post #10
Monday August 17, 2020 8:54am

Joined Jun 2018
Total Posts: 426
Original post from Kamphgruppe

It really boils down to money. So many European teams go broke due to pro/rel. It's not a good business model and there is no way someone in the US wants to buy a team that has no chance to make money. We will win vs the Mex teams when we have enough money to have quality players on the bench, not just starters. MLS is getting closer and closer to this as every new TV contract has lead to lager salaries for players and more money to spend on DP's etc. No matter what you think about the level of the league, it continues to grow and it's fanbase continues to grow and the TV contracts continue to grow. We will eventually have enough money to field teams that can win Concacaf champions league. I would love to have some competition with South American clubs, maybe a combined Champions league is the answer. I like all the pairing up were doing with Liga MX. Hopefully it will be beneficial to both leagues.


Agreed it is growing but not where it should be yet. I think the idea has merit but it would have to be started from scratch and probably wouldn't be offered credibility by its European counterparts. I can see combing with South American teams and creating a regional champion. Then, the regional champion plays in the European competition. I think that would be more lucrative and offers more credibility to the game on this side of the pond. I can see more interest in general from Americans if participating and more money for players and teams.

We saw how Sevilla beat Man United, Lyon beat Man City, Barca got crushed by Bayern and it is not a case of best league but best team. Personally, I think I will write all the MLS teams sometime this week suggesting the proposal of trying to join the Champions League. It is an exercise in futility most likely but it is better than debating the merits or lack thereof without doing the one most crucial part- playing an actual match.

Kamphgruppe
Michigan
Post #11
Monday August 17, 2020 2:37pm

Joined Jul 2012
Total Posts: 1,018
Original post from Samtom23

Agreed it is growing but not where it should be yet. I think the idea has merit but it would have to be started from scratch and probably wouldn't be offered credibility by its European counterparts. I can see combing with South American teams and creating a regional champion. Then, the regional champion plays in the European competition. I think that would be more lucrative and offers more credibility to the game on this side of the pond. I can see more interest in general from Americans if participating and more money for players and teams.

We saw how Sevilla beat Man United, Lyon beat Man City, Barca got crushed by Bayern and it is not a case of best league but best team. Personally, I think I will write all the MLS teams sometime this week suggesting the proposal of trying to join the Champions League. It is an exercise in futility most likely but it is better than debating the merits or lack thereof without doing the one most crucial part- playing an actual match.


I think that if we did an combined North and South American Champions league we could get it to a level that rivaled UFEA champions league. Then maybe there could be a championship match for the 2 winners etc. I don't know but getting MLS teams playing vs. better competition should be the goal. I believe that is what they have begun with all the pairing up with Liga MX. I think the next step would be to include other leagues from the region. I don't want us to Join UFEA Champions league, I would prefer we make our own way, carve out our own piece an stand on our own two feet etc.

Know Nothing
Post #12
Monday August 17, 2020 8:15pm

Joined Jan 2013
Total Posts: 1,796
I think we may be missing a few steps here. Taking too many shortcuts on a shaky foundation will only see things crumble and fall apart.

The obvious answer is to keep developing better quality players. The elite will always make their way to Europe, but the more elite talents we start to develop, the more will stay and better the league.

We will then perhaps mount serious challenges to the CONCACAF Champions League. Once we have success, look to build on that...dominate so to speak. As a byproduct, we can sell the players that stayed for higher prices to put back into the league and development.

Once we start to dominate, there will probably be more investment...people like to back a winner.

We then get to go to the club world championship...keep going back and maybe shock a few teams and win it one year, and we start attracting better athletes to the sport which helps sustain youth development.

Kamphgruppe
Michigan
Post #13
Monday August 17, 2020 9:17pm

Joined Jul 2012
Total Posts: 1,018
Original post from Know Nothing

I think we may be missing a few steps here. Taking too many shortcuts on a shaky foundation will only see things crumble and fall apart.

The obvious answer is to keep developing better quality players. The elite will always make their way to Europe, but the more elite talents we start to develop, the more will stay and better the league.

We will then perhaps mount serious challenges to the CONCACAF Champions League. Once we have success, look to build on that...dominate so to speak. As a byproduct, we can sell the players that stayed for higher prices to put back into the league and development.

Once we start to dominate, there will probably be more investment...people like to back a winner.

We then get to go to the club world championship...keep going back and maybe shock a few teams and win it one year, and we start attracting better athletes to the sport which helps sustain youth development.


Yep, I was in no way advocating to combine concacaf champions league with South America anytime soon. As I mentioned the first steps are the ones we are taking with Liga MX. Getting teams in more meaningful competition with high quality teams being the goal. But someday, yes I would like to see a competition that rivals the European Champions league.


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