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2tone
Ten-Towns
Post #16
Tuesday November 20, 2012 12:59am

Joined Jul 2012
Total Posts: 5,021
Original post from Coach Kev

At the expense of 2014? I think that would be a huge mistake. The young CBs are out there but, much like keepers, that usually are better with age.


Agreed: You don't start building for 2018 and 2022 during the 2014 WC cycle. The 2014 WC is what matters right now. Not 2018 or 2022.

USnLFCfan
Savannah GA
Post #17
Tuesday November 20, 2012 2:19am

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 1,194
Agree with C Kev and 2tone.....no way do we diminish our chances in WC '14 just to ready ourselves for 2018 and beyond...that's what the GC and friendlies are for. The off years in the GC when it doesn't mean qualification for the Confed Cup is when you can experiment a lot with youth/new players. Like this GC this summer, we should see a lot of younger players that are on the edge of making a difference maybe off the bench for the WC. Players like Okugo, Berry, Besler etc at CB (I would try to stick to players that have the skill set as Okugo, because that's where we need to head). Depending on the U-20 WC qualification goes, we should have no problem but if we do then you can call in players like Brooks, Cunningham, and Packwood.

dolcem
Post #18
Wednesday November 21, 2012 3:35pm

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 1,045
It is WAY too early to be even thinking about 2018. The players that will be coming of age then are way too young for our senior squad at the moment.

CB is a tricky position.

Luckily Cameron has emerged as an automatic starter and I trust him against top-level international opposition. Bocanegra still looks good enough to be his partner but he is really old and isn't even playing in a top division. I think he'll be done by 2014 and this injury won't help. But as of now no one is nearly as good as him at CB yet.

I think we should try Edu there again due to our lack of alternatives. He is a very good DM and has the size and athleticism for the position. He's played it before and looked OK so he deserves more chances. The thing is Cameron is mostly playing holding mid for Stoke as is Edu. Do we want our two CB's to be two holding mids? And anyway Edu isn't playing much for Stoke at the moment.

What about Lichaj? He's a RB but can't he play as a CB as well? Hopefully Villa don't get relegated this season and if he gets more PT I think we should try him out there.

Gonzalez: slow, not skilled enough, isn't that young, and plays in the MLS. He should be given a shot but I think he'd be torn to shreds but a lot of teams we might face in the WC.

George John: needs to recover from his injuries. He might've missed his chance to play abroad.

Demerit: love him but he is old and is a lot slower now. Hasn't played at a high level in a few years. And is he even doing that well in the MLS?

Berry, Besler, Borchers, etc.: are any of these guys really starting material for us? I don't really trust MLS CB's for us against top-level teams. The game is so much faster than what the MLS players are used to and one mistake from a CB can cost a game. You want CB's, more than any other position, to be able to read the game well and to feel comfortable. It's the one position that I'd rule out MLS players for. Unless they've played in Europe for a while (and recently) and demonstrate that they still can play at the highest level (perhaps Bocanegra if he moves to the MLS soon and is still our best option).

The guys listed in the OP: none of them are good enough to start for us at the moment. They're all very young but I don't know if I see them as being ready by 2014. Hopefully I'm wrong though.

Onyewu: should be considered. Out of all our CB's he is playing at the highest level. He was a starter at Sporting last season and is now on a Champions League team. And his experience (two prior WC's) is invaluable. But he looked awful for us last time and JK doesn't like slow players. Not to mention he isn't playing much for Malaga right now (I think it was a poor decision to go there, Sporting is a good place for him). I don't think we'll have a choice though, I think he'll end up paired with Cameron.

It's our biggest question mark come 2014 along with winger. I'm pretty nervous about it. But I'm nervous about 2014 in general. We're totally in transition and getting older ever day. Hopefully 2018/2022 will be better.
NO ONE GIVES A SHIT ABOUT WHAT LINEUP YOU USE IN FIFA
Bshredder
Post #19
Wednesday November 21, 2012 4:47pm

Joined Aug 2011
Total Posts: 1,459
Here is a new article

http://www.yanks-abroad.com/content.php?mode=...

2tone
Ten-Towns
Post #20
Wednesday November 21, 2012 4:54pm

Joined Jul 2012
Total Posts: 5,021
Original post from dolcem

It is WAY too early to be even thinking about 2018. The players that will be coming of age then are way too young for our senior squad at the moment.

CB is a tricky position.

Luckily Cameron has emerged as an automatic starter and I trust him against top-level international opposition. Bocanegra still looks good enough to be his partner but he is really old and isn't even playing in a top division. I think he'll be done by 2014 and this injury won't help. But as of now no one is nearly as good as him at CB yet.

I think we should try Edu there again due to our lack of alternatives. He is a very good DM and has the size and athleticism for the position. He's played it before and looked OK so he deserves more chances. The thing is Cameron is mostly playing holding mid for Stoke as is Edu. Do we want our two CB's to be two holding mids? And anyway Edu isn't playing much for Stoke at the moment.

What about Lichaj? He's a RB but can't he play as a CB as well? Hopefully Villa don't get relegated this season and if he gets more PT I think we should try him out there.

Gonzalez: slow, not skilled enough, isn't that young, and plays in the MLS. He should be given a shot but I think he'd be torn to shreds but a lot of teams we might face in the WC.

George John: needs to recover from his injuries. He might've missed his chance to play abroad.

Demerit: love him but he is old and is a lot slower now. Hasn't played at a high level in a few years. And is he even doing that well in the MLS?

Berry, Besler, Borchers, etc.: are any of these guys really starting material for us? I don't really trust MLS CB's for us against top-level teams. The game is so much faster than what the MLS players are used to and one mistake from a CB can cost a game. You want CB's, more than any other position, to be able to read the game well and to feel comfortable. It's the one position that I'd rule out MLS players for. Unless they've played in Europe for a while (and recently) and demonstrate that they still can play at the highest level (perhaps Bocanegra if he moves to the MLS soon and is still our best option).

The guys listed in the OP: none of them are good enough to start for us at the moment. They're all very young but I don't know if I see them as being ready by 2014. Hopefully I'm wrong though.

Onyewu: should be considered. Out of all our CB's he is playing at the highest level. He was a starter at Sporting last season and is now on a Champions League team. And his experience (two prior WC's) is invaluable. But he looked awful for us last time and JK doesn't like slow players. Not to mention he isn't playing much for Malaga right now (I think it was a poor decision to go there, Sporting is a good place for him). I don't think we'll have a choice though, I think he'll end up paired with Cameron.

It's our biggest question mark come 2014 along with winger. I'm pretty nervous about it. But I'm nervous about 2014 in general. We're totally in transition and getting older ever day. Hopefully 2018/2022 will be better.


Cameron is actually playing RB not holding mid.

dolcem
Post #21
Wednesday November 21, 2012 5:39pm

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 1,045
Original post from 2tone

Cameron is actually playing RB not holding mid.


I stand corrected. Either way, he's not playing CB at the moment.

Oh, and I forgot to mention Whitbread, Goodson, and Parkhurst:

Whitbread: always injured.

Goodson: always good for at least one mistake per game. Slow too and not skilled on the ball.

Parkhurst: a bit better than Goodson. One of the two will make the squad and maybe might start next to Cameron if Onyewu doesn't.

I'd rather give Onyewu another shot than Goodson though.
NO ONE GIVES A SHIT ABOUT WHAT LINEUP YOU USE IN FIFA
camparkinson
Post #22
Wednesday November 21, 2012 6:17pm

Joined Aug 2012
Total Posts: 169
Your reasoning of not trusting MLS CB's for international duty is extremely flawed given you trust Cameron who was in the MLS just last year and wasn't a CB in the MLS much and isn't a CB for Stoke now.

If either Besler or Gonzalez were transfered out of the MLS in the near future it wouldn't be surprising as both have proven themselves at this level. Cameron was one of the top players in the MLS and both Besler and Gonzalez have proven they are two of the best defenders in the league, even MVP caliber type players for their teams.

I still think it's Besler, he really stands out to me with the options available. He's not injury prone like many, he's not slow (like Goodson, Boca) he can play out of the back which is a must for JK and especially when playing with not very creative CMs which is another thing JK seems to love doing.

dolcem
Post #23
Wednesday November 21, 2012 6:31pm

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 1,045
Original post from camparkinson

Your reasoning of not trusting MLS CB's for international duty is extremely flawed given you trust Cameron who was in the MLS just last year and wasn't a CB in the MLS much and isn't a CB for Stoke now.

If either Besler or Gonzalez were transfered out of the MLS in the near future it wouldn't be surprising as both have proven themselves at this level. Cameron was one of the top players in the MLS and both Besler and Gonzalez have proven they are two of the best defenders in the league, even MVP caliber type players for their teams.

I still think it's Besler, he really stands out to me with the options available. He's not injury prone like many, he's not slow (like Goodson, Boca) he can play out of the back which is a must for JK and especially when playing with not very creative CMs which is another thing JK seems to love doing.


Cameron is an exception; he's been consistently as good as any defender in the league for a while and has all of the tools. But more importantly I didn't think of him as starting XI material until VERY recently...even his first few games this fall were very shaky. I trust him now that he's playing in the EPL.

I'm not saying MLS defenders can't be good, I'm just saying that it's a gamble until they're playing at a higher level.
NO ONE GIVES A SHIT ABOUT WHAT LINEUP YOU USE IN FIFA
Coach Kev
Savannah, GA
Post #24
Wednesday November 21, 2012 9:16pm

Joined Aug 2012
Total Posts: 283
Original post from dolcem

Cameron is an exception; he's been consistently as good as any defender in the league for a while and has all of the tools. But more importantly I didn't think of him as starting XI material until VERY recently...even his first few games this fall were very shaky. I trust him now that he's playing in the EPL.

I'm not saying MLS defenders can't be good, I'm just saying that it's a gamble until they're playing at a higher level.


Most of our CBs have been in the MLS when they started playing for the Nats. DeMerit is the real exception in there.

As much as I love Gooch, he is terrible now. The injuries seem to have taken a toll on everything from his speed, jumping, and most importantly his decision making.
Bayern fan and American Outlaw
twr96
Post #25
Thursday November 22, 2012 12:12am

Joined Jun 2012
Total Posts: 8
Cameron, Oguchi 2013

Bottlcaps
Post #26
Thursday November 22, 2012 12:46am

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 3
How many US center backs played in the CL today? ( All those who said one, take a bow) The only center back playing in the UEFA CL was Onyewu and he started and went the 90 for Malaga. Whomever said he's slow and over the hill,Malaga & La Liga agrees to differ.

In fact I would like to argue that although Cameron has earned his starts in the USMNT, he is still green and made more than a few errors against Russia.

Omar Gonzales is playing in his second MLS Cup next week and anchors a Galaxy Backline that when they are all healthy and playing, are arguably the best in the MLS. Gonzales return from injury in May coincided with their resurgence that led the Galaxy having the best record in the second half of the season. The Galaxy did something that even Chelsea could not do; contain Wondolowski and Eddie Johnson.

Onyewu and Gonzales should have thier ticket punched to at leat a training camp if not a spot on the 18/22

Footyskillz
Arlington, VA
Post #27
Thursday November 22, 2012 12:50am

Joined Jun 2012
Total Posts: 291
Yeah Gooch is way too slow in every aspect right now. The opportunity is there for him but he needs more games-something hard to come by atm. I don't know why he got such a high rating today...he didn't do that well. I'd like to see him back but it's a long climb for him. Whatever the case it will take some time to figure out. I don't think jan will give us an immediate solution. Though I did find it interesting we went to 3 in the back vs Russia.
USMNT, Porto, and Bundesliga fanatic - T: @gouldinho_j
Footyskillz
Arlington, VA
Post #28
Thursday November 22, 2012 12:59am

Joined Jun 2012
Total Posts: 291
Playing one game in UCL does not mean Gooch is ready for a call up nor does it mean Malaga, Pellegrini, and La Liga think he's a starter. No way. Consistency is key. Gooch has none right now and his form is sketch. As stated before it was a game for Gooch to prove himself since Malaga are already through.

Also, Omar was on his way to a bright career in Germany before being injured. That form is back and it's bs to think he can't compete on an international stage.
USMNT, Porto, and Bundesliga fanatic - T: @gouldinho_j
Coach Kev
Savannah, GA
Post #29
Thursday November 22, 2012 2:53am

Joined Aug 2012
Total Posts: 283
Original post from Bottlcaps

How many US center backs played in the CL today? ( All those who said one, take a bow) The only center back playing in the UEFA CL was Onyewu and he started and went the 90 for Malaga. Whomever said he's slow and over the hill,Malaga & La Liga agrees to differ.


Whoa there. Let's look at the facts (that are easily accessible online btw)

Gooch has started 4 games for Malaga...4 games.... He started today because Malaga already booked their place in the next round. Another game was a cup match against a lower division foe (Malaga gave up 3 goals). He did start in a win against Milan but the other league start was a loss to Real Sociodad. Also the fact that Demichellis starts for Malaga also shows the level of their CBs (meaning he is terrible).

Again I am sure anyone who remembers his famous stare down against mexico would love to have him back to his old self and would agree if that were the case he would be an automatic start. The fact is he has not shown that as of late. He has been dreadful in his last few starts for the Nats.
Bayern fan and American Outlaw
twr96
Post #30
Thursday November 22, 2012 4:36am

Joined Jun 2012
Total Posts: 8
I could be wrong is Omar Gonzalez's contract up?

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