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bjelks
Post #316
Wednesday July 15, 2020 12:42am

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 1,667
I'll clarify we have the quality to challenge any team in the world. We have top level players at every position. I don't know what other teams you're speaking of but we can talk about matchups and no one in the world is bossing us. Im not sure how you evaluate the game. We aren't rated highly bc no one has ever seen our full team play together and our coach is an idiot when it comes to picking reserves and tactics. Again, our depth will be fine by 2022 and we have 2 of the most coveted fullbacks in the world, who again you've never seen play together.
And our CBs are our deepest position and good. You may need to do more research on the program @hamsamwich.
goalsense
Gilster
Los Angeles
Post #317
Wednesday July 15, 2020 12:52am

Joined Jul 2019
Total Posts: 10
Original post from 2tone

I would say our attacking talent is pretty unproven besides Pulisic and Morris. The rest are young and just starting to get significant minutes. I don't think our attacking pool sucks at all. Our defense is coming along too. Dest, Brooks, Cannon, Long, EPB, Both Robinson's. There are some good pieces. Bit Adams and Mckennie are developing very good and have become integral players for their clubs. We are missing a bit more in midfield but I think Pomykal, Nagbe, Ledezma, and Cappis will help.


Can't believe you just mentioned Pulisic and Morris in the same breath. Morris is not proven at anything because he doesn't play with or against the best in the world.
Gilbert
Samtom23
Post #318
Wednesday July 15, 2020 1:32am

Joined Jun 2018
Total Posts: 351
Original post from Gilster

Can't believe you just mentioned Pulisic and Morris in the same breath. Morris is not proven at anything because he doesn't play with or against the best in the world.


Go watch the Mexico game again. He was our second best player on the pitch after being subbed in for Boyd. And the European players had a bad game. Boyd didn't mark his man, Mckennie missed the middle man to pass to and put Steffen in a bad place. Steffen should've cleared the ball. And lastly, Morales can't ran pass. But it is a team game and both European and MLS'ers have accountability. But Mexico pressing, USA didn't counter.
Having players like Adams and Pomykal in the line-up next time around should help.

2tone
Ten-Towns
Post #319
Wednesday July 15, 2020 1:52am

Joined Jul 2012
Total Posts: 10,567
Original post from Gilster

Can't believe you just mentioned Pulisic and Morris in the same breath. Morris is not proven at anything because he doesn't play with or against the best in the world.


Lol. He's a proven winner. Sorry to break that to you. Haters gonna hate!

Kamphgruppe
Michigan
Post #320
Wednesday July 15, 2020 3:09am

Joined Jul 2012
Total Posts: 989
Original post from Gilster

Can't believe you just mentioned Pulisic and Morris in the same breath. Morris is not proven at anything because he doesn't play with or against the best in the world.


Everyone was on the Morris bandwagon but then he committed the crime of following his dream rather than do what the fans wanted him to do. I wish he had gone to Germany too, but he has wanted to play for Seattle all his life. So now Morris is a pariah to all the Eruo Snobs on this board.

bjelks
Post #321
Wednesday July 15, 2020 4:53am

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 1,667
Original post from Samtom23

Go watch the Mexico game again. He was our second best player on the pitch after being subbed in for Boyd. And the European players had a bad game. Boyd didn't mark his man, Mckennie missed the middle man to pass to and put Steffen in a bad place. Steffen should've cleared the ball. And lastly, Morales can't ran pass. But it is a team game and both European and MLS'ers have accountability. But Mexico pressing, USA didn't counter.
Having players like Adams and Pomykal in the line-up next time around should help.


Morris started the Mexico game in the GC final and he looked completely over his head and useless.

By the time Morris got into the Mexico friendly the game was over.

I'll say this again we don't know if Weah, Reyna, Uly, or Konrad would do better and that's the problem with all this Morris hype.

Also if we're going to call Morris a proven winner, we need to give the same credit to League One players
goalsense
Samtom23
Post #322
Wednesday July 15, 2020 5:35am

Joined Jun 2018
Total Posts: 351
Original post from bjelks

Morris started the Mexico game in the GC final and he looked completely over his head and useless.

By the time Morris got into the Mexico friendly the game was over.

I'll say this again we don't know if Weah, Reyna, Uly, or Konrad would do better and that's the problem with all this Morris hype.

Also if we're going to call Morris a proven winner, we need to give the same credit to League One players


Morris came on 58 minutes in the game. The score was then 1-0.

The only time the game is over when it is 1-0 is when the final whistle is blown. Mexico scored 78 and 82 minutes into the match. Morris wasn't part of conceded goals.

https://www.espn.com/soccer/match?gameId=552070

I am not unopposed to give Weah, Reyna, Uly, Konrad calls. But to discredit Morris because he isn't playing in Europe is a bit biased.

bjelks
Post #323
Wednesday July 15, 2020 2:41pm

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 1,667
Original post from Samtom23

Morris came on 58 minutes in the game. The score was then 1-0.

The only time the game is over when it is 1-0 is when the final whistle is blown. Mexico scored 78 and 82 minutes into the match. Morris wasn't part of conceded goals.

https://www.espn.com/soccer/match?gameId=552070

I am not unopposed to give Weah, Reyna, Uly, Konrad calls. But to discredit Morris because he isn't playing in Europe is a bit biased.


There's a difference between discrediting Morris and not giving him credit for not doing anything impressive.

So Morris played 32mins and didn't create an assist or score a goal? Got it.
goalsense
Lilshmike
Post #324
Wednesday July 15, 2020 3:26pm

Joined Oct 2012
Total Posts: 1,416
To be frank... all the emphasis being placed on Llanez and his one performance for the national team... come on guys.

A lot of the people praising him are the same people who have bashed camp cupcake and said that MLS players only play good against crap CONCACAF teams.

Llanez played one game in camp cupcake against a Costa Rica C+ to B- team. A crap CONCACAF team. Lets get real here and put things into perspective because a lot of y'all out here are talking yourselves into contradictory circles, or performing mental gymnastics that make you look like idiots.

The kid is good... he stood out in a weak/experimental MLS based squad, and performed well against a similarly weak/experimental squad from Costa Rica. Hes one to look to for the future... but hes gotta consistently get into the senior team for his club before we can take him seriously.

Samtom23
Post #325
Wednesday July 15, 2020 3:40pm

Joined Jun 2018
Total Posts: 351
Original post from bjelks

There's a difference between discrediting Morris and not giving him credit for not doing anything impressive.

So Morris played 32mins and didn't create an assist or score a goal? Got it.


Well, a game isn't over at 1-0 as you claimed. Also, he (Morris) created the most chances. Also, at 87:00 minutes into the game, he got a penalty in the box. Unfortunately, Sargent missed it.

bjelks
Post #326
Wednesday July 15, 2020 4:10pm

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 1,667
Original post from Lilshmike

To be frank... all the emphasis being placed on Llanez and his one performance for the national team... come on guys.

A lot of the people praising him are the same people who have bashed camp cupcake and said that MLS players only play good against crap CONCACAF teams.

Llanez played one game in camp cupcake against a Costa Rica C+ to B- team. A crap CONCACAF team. Lets get real here and put things into perspective because a lot of y'all out here are talking yourselves into contradictory circles, or performing mental gymnastics that make you look like idiots.

The kid is good... he stood out in a weak/experimental MLS based squad, and performed well against a similarly weak/experimental squad from Costa Rica. Hes one to look to for the future... but hes gotta consistently get into the senior team for his club before we can take him seriously.


The problem we keep coming back to is that the mls guys that you would rather see play in front of him can't get into his team either?

So we have to question, what is the value of first team mins when the level is so low?
goalsense
bjelks
Post #327
Wednesday July 15, 2020 4:12pm

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 1,667
Original post from Samtom23

Well, a game isn't over at 1-0 as you claimed. Also, he (Morris) created the most chances. Also, at 87:00 minutes into the game, he got a penalty in the box. Unfortunately, Sargent missed it.


We've been through this. Pulisic and Mckennie created chances and Morris benefitted from them.
This doesn't tell me that Uly doesn't do better with the same chances created for him or with less chances.

We feel differently about Morris bc we see the game differently and that's ok.
goalsense
Lilshmike
Post #328
Wednesday July 15, 2020 4:34pm

Joined Oct 2012
Total Posts: 1,416
Original post from bjelks

The problem we keep coming back to is that the mls guys that you would rather see play in front of him can't get into his team either?

So we have to question, what is the value of first team mins when the level is so low?
Did I mention any MLS guys that I would put in front of him?

No.

Not everything is an "MLS vs everyone else" debate as you try to frame it. Especially when I legitimately made no mention of any MLS guys who I would pick over the kid. Thats one of the issues you have. Any post, opinion, statement that runs against your own views, you immediately lob the whole "MLS fanboy" crap at the person. You've gotten better at it, but you still do it constantly.

We have guys getting first team minutes at clubs in MLS, in England, in Germany, in Denmark, etc. Is Llanez getting called in over Pulisic? Reyna? Weah when healthy? Honestly hes still behind Morris in the pecking order. Sabbi is in front of him. Tyler Boyd?

So the reality is... when we have a full roster of healthy guys to pick from, he very likely won't get called in. This isn't a theoretical debate. This is reality.

There are a bunch of guys we have in front of him until he gets through into the first team at Wolfsburg. And many, yourself included, have made claims we need to call him in over MLS players who can only perform against crappy CONCACAF team because of his one performance... against a crappy CONCACAF team...

Lets hop off the hype train and put things into perspective, because a lot of people are failing to do that. Llanez is in the bucket of "promising youth prospect and one to look out for in the coming years" not "he is a top 23 player and should be called in to our national team".

Totally get the sentiment of "lets give it a try, we've got nothing to lose"... but again, putting things into perspective... the only opportunities we have for that are friendlies... which he was featured in... and when it comes to a competitive game, there are others in front of him when everyone is healthy and available. At some point soon that may very well change, but at this current moment, that is his status.

stoked-3
Post #329
Wednesday July 15, 2020 5:04pm

Joined Mar 2020
Total Posts: 40
Original post from Lilshmike

To be frank... all the emphasis being placed on Llanez and his one performance for the national team... come on guys.

A lot of the people praising him are the same people who have bashed camp cupcake and said that MLS players only play good against crap CONCACAF teams.

Llanez played one game in camp cupcake against a Costa Rica C+ to B- team. A crap CONCACAF team. Lets get real here and put things into perspective because a lot of y'all out here are talking yourselves into contradictory circles, or performing mental gymnastics that make you look like idiots.

The kid is good... he stood out in a weak/experimental MLS based squad, and performed well against a similarly weak/experimental squad from Costa Rica. Hes one to look to for the future... but hes gotta consistently get into the senior team for his club before we can take him seriously.


You just wrote Zardes deserves to be called up bc of his performance in an MLS tournament scoring 2 goals (1 nice, 1 school yard) against the worst team in the league after an extened break- but now are saying Uly played against a bad team so he performance doesnt mean anything?

Regardless of what you thought of the Costa squad-Uly was the best player on the field, not by a little but by a lot showed alot of technical ability. All of that while not having 1st team mins.

To say he needs to break into a top team in a top league before he gets called in bc we have guys who are playing in mls getting 1st team mins misses the mark.

Will ULY work out, who knows, but what I do know is if i was coach he would get called in b.c he performed, 1st appearnce no nerves and dominated.

BTW: that team had I believe: Cannon, Long, Zimmerman, J Yeuill, S Legett. So those are guys that get called alot.

So if I guy out performs other guys on the INT stage regardless of where they play, or dont play or whether they start or not they deserve to be called in, regardless if that is ideal or not.

We call in guys like Wondo, Zardes, BArid, Roldon, Trapp, Omar, Zimmerman etc and they dont show well and we say well they are killing it with thier clubs so we have to take them. The play at club may warrent a call but your play when on the Int stage determins if you stay.

Just so you do not come back with accusing me of bashing mls-I like morrs i would pick him in my 23, bc I think he adds something as a super sub. I am ok with Long, I think guys Like Jesus F, Robinson, Pomk etc should get looks.

Lima is a good example: he didnt have a stellar mls track record but yet when he played I thought he played well-confused why he didnt get further looks-

so we need to evaluate players who can hang and those who cant. ULY deserves more call ups up until his play sucks on the Int for x amount of Int games. Dont forget we see alot of the same mls guys get picked regardless of their performance-so other mls guys, euro fringe, and young guns should get the same opp to show what they got. Guys like Soto will flame out, Uly showed he belongs for now

Lilshmike
Post #330
Wednesday July 15, 2020 5:34pm

Joined Oct 2012
Total Posts: 1,416
@stoked-3

No... no that is not what I said at all. I am referring to your following statement:

"You just wrote Zardes deserves to be called up bc of his performance in an MLS tournament scoring 2 goals (1 nice, 1 school yard) against the worst team in the league after an extened break"

Here in fact is exactly what I stated:
Original post from Lilshmike

This isn't new news, I've been saying this since the beginning... but of course, stating the obvious causes people's heads to explode and leads to cries of fanboyism and having some sort of MLS agenda, etc.

The harsh reality is that hes one of the best we've got. Hes been the most consistent forward we've had over the last few years. Am I sayin he is our best? No. Am I saying I would start him? No.

But he is in the conversation for the 23 whether we like it or not. However, simply bringing up and stating the wildly obvious is controversial on this website...
Its been said before, but reading comprehension seems to be an issue on this site.

I'm not saying he deserves to be in the USMNT because he scored 2 goals against Cincy. I'm stating the obvious that whether we like it or not he is in the conversation because he continues to produce at club when others haven't.

Thanks for proving my point about heads exploding when even merely bringing up Zardes.

My point on Llanez wasn't directed at you. It was directed at the entire group. So don't take offense. And I'm not wrong on that either. Same as I haven't been wrong on Zardes. I keep saying hes sticking around... he continues to stick around... and I get called an MLS fanboy or USSF lover. No... no, I'm not. I just know what I'm talking about and point out the obvious.

And... when exactly was the last time Wondo or Omar played for the national team? Exactly. Why even bring up those names? Trapp... omg, been over this, look at his minutes for the national team... the guy is no longer playing. Same with Baird, he has 4 caps. I agree on Roldan... but Zimmerman has done enough to show he is competent and can fill in if needed. Which is exactly what his role has been thus far. Move on and find another thing to complain about or use a better example.

I'm not accusing you of bashing MLS. But for each nonsense MLS name someone can bring up, I can find another example of someone else getting called in and being given a shot from outside MLS or one of the names may people on this site call for. But people always need to find something to complain about...

But to bring it full circle... I agree there are some head scratching inclusions at times... but when people are getting mad over mentioning a guy (Zardes) getting called in at ST when we have no other STs who are putting up the same type of numbers consistently as he has been... its comical. I don't like the guy... but whether we like it or not, he keeps doing it for club when others aren't. So I will state again, it should be no surprise when he gets called in. Thats not me claiming I want to see him pull on a USMNT shirt... thats me CLEARLY stating that hes going to keep sticking around until other guys start pushing him out. That is the reality.

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