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Kamphgruppe
Michigan
Post #31
Sunday February 2, 2020 1:39pm

Joined Jul 2012
Total Posts: 909
Original post from chris_thebassplayer

I'm a GB supporter. I've always said just give him time. He's bringing in quality youth and expanding the roster options...he's going to have some very good talent to choose from...and Imo, he won't hesitate to bring in talent that can get him wins, regardless of age.


I went on record saying that I was ready to move on from GB but TBH he has done well considering the state of US soccer when he took over. I now support giving him until the the world cup plays out. Many here (myself included) were not happy with his original core of starters because it seemed like the same old thing. He has shown that he is willing move on from players he knows and trust when a better player comes along. It may not move as quickly as some of us would like, but at least we can see some positive change.

cudevil
Post #32
Sunday February 2, 2020 3:19pm

Joined Oct 2012
Total Posts: 1,007
I'm reserving any commentary until we see what happens during a FIFA window. Given limitations on player availability for this game/camp, he has to be more flexible.

Know Nothing
Post #33
Sunday February 2, 2020 4:56pm

Joined Jan 2013
Total Posts: 1,742
The one thing you can count on from Arriola is he will always give you 100% effort. Sometimes you need that in a young side.

As for the rest of the match, not bad. For me, the question is how many of these players would you realistically call in in a one off elimination match where the entire pool is healthy? From this group, maybe Long, Canon, Yeull, and Llanez. I would call in Arriola to push them in practice, but not for the squad.

bjelks
Post #34
Sunday February 2, 2020 5:06pm

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 1,416
For me Long is behind Brooks, Miazga. I rate Alvarado, EPB and Richards higher.
For me Cannon is behind Dest, Chandler and Yedlin.
Yueill behind Adams and Morales with Cardosa coming on.
And I like Ully a lot, but there's Pulisic, Weah, Konrad at wing.
We should look really good going into qualifying
goalsense
bjelks
Post #35
Sunday February 2, 2020 5:32pm

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 1,416
I forgot Reyna. He would also have to be included in the wing options going forward
goalsense
2tone
Ten-Towns
Post #36
Sunday February 2, 2020 5:51pm

Joined Jul 2012
Total Posts: 10,506
Original post from bjelks

For me Long is behind Brooks, Miazga. I rate Alvarado, EPB and Richards higher.
For me Cannon is behind Dest, Chandler and Yedlin.
Yueill behind Adams and Morales with Cardosa coming on.
And I like Ully a lot, but there's Pulisic, Weah, Konrad at wing.
We should look really good going into qualifying


Hmmmm...... I don't rate Alvarado, Richards, or EPB higher than Long right now. Brooks has been benched. Very good scouts in Germany think Richards has quite a ways to go as CB. He may never see the Bayern first team. He probably needs to be loaned to a Bundesliga 2 team next year to get pro experience.

EPB plays in a league that isn't the highest quality. He has talent, but he isn't better than Long right now.

Alvarado probably deserves another shot with the USMNT.

Dave
Post #37
Sunday February 2, 2020 6:45pm

Joined Jul 2014
Total Posts: 1,021
Original post from bjelks

For me Long is behind Brooks, Miazga. I rate Alvarado, EPB and Richards higher.
For me Cannon is behind Dest, Chandler and Yedlin.
Yueill behind Adams and Morales with Cardosa coming on.
And I like Ully a lot, but there's Pulisic, Weah, Konrad at wing.
We should look really good going into qualifying

-
When ranking CBs you have to take into consideration which side they play on. While some can play either side, most have tendencies that make them better suited for one side or the other. Right now (If healthy) I'd rank them as follows:
RCB - Miazga, Long, EPB, M. Robinson, Richards
LCB - Brooks, Alvalado, CCV, Zimmerman
-
While I like Chandler I'm still not sold on him with the USMNT. I'd be more inclined if we moved to a 3 in the back formation with wingbacks. I think that would help out all our outside backs. That said right now Dest is our starting LB with (hopefully) A. Robinson as the back-up. If Gloster, Vines, or someone else can step up to become a dependable back-up...than we can talk about moving Dest into the RB discussion.
Till then Yedlin, Cannon, & Chandler are all in contention for the RB spot, and the margin of difference is very, very slim (IMO).
The winger position is wide open (with exception of Pulisic). Weah, Reyna, Vassilev, Llanez, & De La Fuente are all on the rise and I wouldn't be surprised to see any of them in the March Friendlies (unless they're with the Olympic Team). Right now Morris & Arriola are serviceable...and if Boyd ever gets going that'll be another option.
-
I'm still reserving judgement on Berhaulter. I still have many concerns when it comes to his player selections and his tactics. I want to see what he does when he's given the full pool to chose from and the standard FIFA window (5 days) to work with them. However, if we continue to see Roldan & Bradley getting calls & seeing minutes when we clearly have better options I'll have some serious issues with him.

chris_thebassplayer
San Jose
Post #38
Sunday February 2, 2020 7:49pm

Joined May 2013
Total Posts: 1,531
My question is why put Dest and Cannon in direct competition at RB. Granted you could flip Dest to LB but his attacking skill on the wing is really high end... very high soccer IQ...and his D at this point is much further behind his attacking game.

The primary job for a fullback is to be a sound defender. I don't know what you guys are missing...for me it is clearly Cannon as the best most focused defender. Don't even bring up Yedlin at RB... his tune outs cost us points and he can't buy a pass out of the back...really one dimensional player with costly defensive errors for the nats. Imo, he doesn't fit what GB is looking for at that position. GB has even stated he sees Yedlin as more of a wing option.

Right now Dest would be one of our best flank attackers...I also think he would be as good or better than most of the young wing talent we have coming up.

Cannon is turning into a lock down defender...just play Dest in front of him at Rmid.

RE: Long...he is a very very good CB. Very consistent and steady in performance. Brooks is streaky and injury prone. On his best days he is better than Long, but who knows which Brooks will show up...when he is 100% healthy...which is not often.

I'm excited to see Robinson and Richards develop, but right now Long is our best most consistent option. Some of the other CBs mentioned are not consistent enough...to be starters at a good level of play...just cuz they play on euro teams doesn't make them magically better than Long.

bjelks
Post #39
Sunday February 2, 2020 8:48pm

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 1,416
We've never seen Cannon defend or pass against a decent level of play. I like Cannon, but he's a prime example of our mls fans overhyping guys just bc they are mls players.
We see Yedlin against an elite level of play every week and he handles himself well

Antonee Has the ability to be an AC Milan 1st team player, he's more than good enough to be our starting left back.

Dest just won king of the match at rb against PSV, his defending is good enough to be our RB.

Van Dijk, Boateng, Laporte, Alderweireld are very good defenders, Long is nowhere close to that level and he's in his late 20s.
Long is being pursued by an EPL team headed for relegation that won't bid more than 5 mil for him. Very good players could demand more from a better team.
Reason is Long's ceiling is bottom table EPL or Championship.

I can't say I understand the comparisons between Long's consistency and the rest of the pool considering he was consistently a dumpster fire against Mexico, Venezuela, and Canada.
Furthermore, we haven't seen enough Miazga, EPB, or Richards to conclude that they're not up to par or better.
Lastly, according to @lilshmike's analysis, Long plays in the 18th-20th best league in the world so we can't even say he plays at a higher level than EPB, Miazga or Richards.
goalsense
camparkinson
Post #40
Sunday February 2, 2020 11:44pm

Joined Aug 2012
Total Posts: 340
Except that Yedlin has been trash in a USA jersey the past few years and Cannon has looked great in all games, even against Mexico.

I'd love to see Cannon RB and Dest LB. I'd also love to see Cannon (and Lima) given chances at LB of more games from Ream/Lovitz/Gaspar... I never understood what Lima did to go from starter and good performances to never see the field ever again with Berhalter. I don't think Lima is a stud player but he's solid and has shown well in his chances.

I also would love to see Antonee more as well, I don't get why he's not in all of the FIFA date camps.

Long isn't amazing but has been pretty good in the chances he's been given. Of course more looks should be given out to others but Miazga hasn't been better in his games with the USA than Moore. EPB and Richards I'd love to see more of and hopefully we'll get to with the Olympic team.

I also think Holmes has been a huge snub in 2019, especially the second half of the year when he was playing well and consistently for club.

bjelks
Post #41
Monday February 3, 2020 12:10am

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 1,416
Again what good competition has Cannon played against lol?
And I'd argue Yedlin has been solid against better competition.
I understand guys wanna see mls players, well not really, but why do it at the expense of the team?
I mean to keep a Milan target off the field for a player that's not even an mls all star is a bit silly
goalsense
Know Nothing
Post #42
Monday February 3, 2020 5:07am

Joined Jan 2013
Total Posts: 1,742
The Dest/Cannon/Yedlin argument really depends on where you want to play Dest...is he more valuable as an attacker or as a defender?

I would argue you could play Dest as a winger and Yedlin/Cannon as RB and we would be stronger and more balanced than say Dest as RB and someone else on the wing.

I can imagine a 4-2-3-1 with a front four of Weah, Sargent, CP, and Dest with Adams and WM in supporting MF roles.

camparkinson
Post #43
Monday February 3, 2020 5:23am

Joined Aug 2012
Total Posts: 340
I'm not going based on what they have done with their clubs, I'm going off what they have done with the USA shirt.

Yedlin has been bad, just plane bad... not sure why but it's true and I hope you can admit that.

Cannon has been very solid and has been one of the better players in most of the games he's played in for the USA both against bad teams and good.

Antonee has been bad for USA but I still love his skill set and want to see more and am upset we haven't seen him in camps.

Lima is not a stud and will never be amazing. But he has shown to be solid and I think deserves to be in camps and have no clue why he's never been given a shot at LB when we keep trotting out Ream/Lovitz.

bjelks
Post #44
Monday February 3, 2020 5:44am

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 1,416
We honestly have good enough players at every other position to not force Dest out of his natural position at RB.

Holmes is a natural 10/8, can drive the ball through the midfield, turn with a defender on his shoulder, play a ball in and crack one from 30 yds out. He should be our starting 10 in March

Ledezma is pure 10 with world class ability.

Robinson is a top 5 rated left back in the Championship and is targeted by Milan and Lyon.
I'm gonna say something truthful but hurtful, Cannon isn't in Robinson's class.
He doesn't have the technique or experience.
It would be silly to build the formation to accommodate him.

If we really want to have an honest convo about right backs, Chandler is 2nd behind Dest. He's easily the most proven and playing at the highest level.

Cannon's best performances have come against a Mexican domestic player, a disinterested Uruguay b squad and an experimental Italy squad that failed to qualify, arguably their worst team ever. So to say he's a Better player at the international level than 2 players proven in the EPL and Bundesliga is just not true.

He's played well against concacaf and low tier teams and being overhyped like Long
goalsense
cudevil
Post #45
Monday February 3, 2020 1:30pm

Joined Oct 2012
Total Posts: 1,007
I think Robinson vs. Cannon is an open question. Cannon is basically a year younger. Robinson plays on one of the worst teams in League One...something I'm sure Cannon could do. Yes, Robinson's transfer to AC Milan fell through on a technicality, but this isn't your father's Milan-they are a mid-table team-and we don't know that Robinson would have earned immediate PT. Lastly, Robinson has been bad in his MNT opportunities, while Cannon has been solid to good.

Robinson might have the edge, but it's slight, at best.

That said, I'm still taking Yedlin over both, and by a fair margin (for now).

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