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Kamphgruppe
Michigan
Post #91
Sunday October 20, 2019 2:53pm

Joined Jul 2012
Total Posts: 907
Original post from stoked3

Also I believe @bjelks said when you put euro guys next to mls guys who think slower it dumbs them down.



So which euro players played well??? CP did not, McKennie did not, Sargent did not, Yedlin did not, etc. Blaming MLS when players from MLS were also dominating on the other side of the ball? The problem with the national team is not MLS. We have lost the determination and grit we used to have. Just like the T&T game guys jogging around like they could not be bothered. I want players that are hungry to play for the nats, I don't care what league, what experience etc. just want players that will come out and fight EVERY game.

bjelks
Post #92
Sunday October 20, 2019 4:18pm

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 1,414
How can you properly assess players when you don't give them the tools to do their job or complement them with competent support?

Gregg is purposely setting the "euro" guys up for failure and giving the USSF a cop out to say "well the euro guys played bad" by surrounding them with useless players and charging them with carrying the team.

As a player, I can imagine how frustrating it is when you're heavily criticized for not carrying players that shouldn't have been on the team in the first place.

If you look at the nuance of the game:
- Pulisic is dribbling 1v5 because Roldan is either not available or losing the ball as soon as he receives
- Sarg doesn't look good because again his 10 (Roldan) is incapable of doing anything positive, no balls played through, not winning 50/50s, no creative combo play
- Pulisic is also doing all the dribbling, because his opposite Wing (Morris) can't dribble, he just makes short laterals and waits on CP to do something or runs into walls like a crash dummy
- Furthermore Morris cannot play out of tight spaces, why Because he never developed that in MLS
- Mckennie looks bad because Gregg again told him to protect Bradley at all costs and drive fwd, which is impossible because Bradley doesnt move and again offers nothing going fwd
- Lastly Yedlin is accustomed to CBs that recognize danger and step it to it quickly, Long doesn't do that so of course they are disjointed

Our lesser parts are so bad that we're actually lesser than the sum of our parts

And I'll add playing with heart is useless if you lack quality, which is our biggest problem.

And if you want to find more quality, we have to find new players that are pushing themselves and are hungry
goalsense
Kamphgruppe
Michigan
Post #93
Sunday October 20, 2019 8:45pm

Joined Jul 2012
Total Posts: 907
Original post from bjelks

How can you properly assess players when you don't give them the tools to do their job or complement them with competent support?

Gregg is purposely setting the "euro" guys up for failure and giving the USSF a cop out to say "well the euro guys played bad" by surrounding them with useless players and charging them with carrying the team.

As a player, I can imagine how frustrating it is when you're heavily criticized for not carrying players that shouldn't have been on the team in the first place.

If you look at the nuance of the game:
- Pulisic is dribbling 1v5 because Roldan is either not available or losing the ball as soon as he receives
- Sarg doesn't look good because again his 10 (Roldan) is incapable of doing anything positive, no balls played through, not winning 50/50s, no creative combo play
- Pulisic is also doing all the dribbling, because his opposite Wing (Morris) can't dribble, he just makes short laterals and waits on CP to do something or runs into walls like a crash dummy
- Furthermore Morris cannot play out of tight spaces, why Because he never developed that in MLS
- Mckennie looks bad because Gregg again told him to protect Bradley at all costs and drive fwd, which is impossible because Bradley doesnt move and again offers nothing going fwd
- Lastly Yedlin is accustomed to CBs that recognize danger and step it to it quickly, Long doesn't do that so of course they are disjointed

Our lesser parts are so bad that we're actually lesser than the sum of our parts

And I'll add playing with heart is useless if you lack quality, which is our biggest problem.

And if you want to find more quality, we have to find new players that are pushing themselves and are hungry


What a cop out, I expect better from you. It's not the MLS guys fault the euro guys played like garbage. You need to hold them to the same standard as you do the MLS guys.

That being said, I am ready to play anyone who doesn't jog around like they don't care. If I was the coach I would not invite that player to the next game and let them know why. So yeah, lets go with the players you want to start. Better yet, lets get a new coach.

blaise213
Post #94
Sunday October 20, 2019 8:52pm

Joined Sep 2012
Total Posts: 3,023
Original post from Kamphgruppe

What a cop out, I expect better from you. It's not the MLS guys fault the euro guys played like garbage. You need to hold them to the same standard as you do the MLS guys.

That being said, I am ready to play anyone who doesn't jog around like they don't care. If I was the coach I would not invite that player to the next game and let them know why. So yeah, lets go with the players you want to start. Better yet, lets get a new coach.


Naw he nailed it.

I said this before. Its like having Steph Curry and draymond Green, playing with the G League players for a game.. that's what MLS is for the USMNT..

And I also said there's better MLS options too !

Kamphgruppe
Michigan
Post #95
Sunday October 20, 2019 9:10pm

Joined Jul 2012
Total Posts: 907
Original post from blaise213

Naw he nailed it.

I said this before. Its like having Steph Curry and draymond Green, playing with the G League players for a game.. that's what MLS is for the USMNT..

And I also said there's better MLS options too !


You guys talk about accountability but won't admit when your pets don't play well.
So let me get this straight, if we lose no matter what it's the MLS guys fault. If the MLS guys play great and score all the goals it's only because of the Euro guys.

Look I am not really an MLS guy but your hatred of the league borders on delusional.

blaise213
Post #96
Sunday October 20, 2019 9:21pm

Joined Sep 2012
Total Posts: 3,023
Original post from Kamphgruppe

You guys talk about accountability but won't admit when your pets don't play well.
So let me get this straight, if we lose no matter what it's the MLS guys fault. If the MLS guys play great and score all the goals it's only because of the Euro guys.

Look I am not really an MLS guy but your hatred of the league borders on delusional.


The current MLS selections can't attack 1 vs 1, back pass under pressure, kick long balls all day long, lose possession easily, have poor passing, slow soccer IQ, and never chest the ball down.. Some don't even start for their team which is bizarre too..

The only MLS guys that deserve a look are Aaronson, Parks, Toye, Pomykal, Ferreira, Miles Robinson.

Kamphgruppe
Michigan
Post #97
Sunday October 20, 2019 10:26pm

Joined Jul 2012
Total Posts: 907
Original post from blaise213

The current MLS selections can't attack 1 vs 1, back pass under pressure, kick long balls all day long, lose possession easily, have poor passing, slow soccer IQ, and never chest the ball down.. Some don't even start for their team which is bizarre too..

The only MLS guys that deserve a look are Aaronson, Parks, Toye, Pomykal, Ferreira, Miles Robinson.


And the Euro guys were equally horrible at all these things, and some of them don't start for their teams which is bizarre too.

blaise213
Post #98
Sunday October 20, 2019 10:56pm

Joined Sep 2012
Total Posts: 3,023
Original post from Kamphgruppe

And the Euro guys were equally horrible at all these things, and some of them don't start for their teams which is bizarre too.


But according to everyone Pulisic sucked in the Canada game but does well in the Chelsea game. That's the result of playing with D league players vs playing with Talented players

blaise213
Post #99
Sunday October 20, 2019 10:58pm

Joined Sep 2012
Total Posts: 3,023
The Philly vs Red Bull's game is entertaining

Kamphgruppe
Michigan
Post #100
Sunday October 20, 2019 11:01pm

Joined Jul 2012
Total Posts: 907
Original post from blaise213

But according to everyone Pulisic sucked in the Canada game but does well in the Chelsea game. That's the result of playing with D league players vs playing with Talented players


He had the flu, I am guessing he just had a bad day.

db707
Post #101
Sunday October 20, 2019 11:35pm

Joined Oct 2013
Total Posts: 1,045
Original post from Kamphgruppe

What a cop out, I expect better from you.


You do? Why?

stoked3
Ft Lauderdale, FL
Post #102
Sunday October 20, 2019 11:41pm

Joined Oct 2014
Total Posts: 338
Original post from Kamphgruppe

So which euro players played well??? CP did not, McKennie did not, Sargent did not, Yedlin did not, etc. Blaming MLS when players from MLS were also dominating on the other side of the ball? The problem with the national team is not MLS. We have lost the determination and grit we used to have. Just like the T&T game guys jogging around like they could not be bothered. I want players that are hungry to play for the nats, I don't care what league, what experience etc. just want players that will come out and fight EVERY game.


My post was referencing how Josh Sargaent, CP, Matt M, Yedlin, all went back to their clubs and played well this weekend--yet they looked lost vs Canada. That tells us alot, some players they play with from mls are mentally and tactically behind. It also tells us that GB was outcoached bc the other team had alot of mls players.

Zack Steffan was interviewed in Germany and he said GB system is so complex that guys are not playing with instinct and skill, rather they are out there trying to think what to do in a system.

Mckenzie plays really well for his Club rarely this yr has he looked out of place. JS dropped back v Canada bc there was no service. CP played horrible you could tell he was sick-GB should not have played him-CP looked like he was playing not to get hurt v cuba bc he realized it was a stupid game -he should not have played that game either. That should have been a game to play younger players. Aronson etc

The problem with the Nat is certianly partly MLS. Jordan Morris is a great example-he could take his career to the next level and go overseas but he is in a league where he will be praised week in and out and no one will ever push him for his spot. He is in a system with US soccer that says if you get called up from MLS you generally get called up-he comes back from being injured and is out for 18 months and he gets called in after 1 game? But the argument against Williams, holmes has been injuries so we can't bring them in.

There is not 1 problem with the Nats but MLS is a big part of it. Since bradley came back he has been in a decline, some of that is age, some of it is he is no longer pushed-Jozy had to leave overseas bc he is not on that level.

You have Long who would benefit greatly by going overseas yet MLS didn't let him go, now we have Paxton who just signed to stay.

So back to your comments. No our Euro guys didnt look good, but CP was taking 4 to 5 guys on at once, WM had no one next to him (I didn't even know Roldon was on the field) JS didn't have service etc

I was for giving GB a chance but he has proven to be an idiot. If you think I am totally against mls that is not the case, I listed guys in a dif post who should have played and or should be called in from MLS BUT GB just picks the same guys.

Good Example : Sebastian L-if you are trying to play possession how does he sit the bench and Roldon start? I actually rate SL and think he has a place on the team, he has technical skills-he can trap the ball you can tell he played overseas. What has Roldon shown you to make you think he should even recalled into camp cupcake--

Where I do agree with you is the Nats lacks bite- I believe Adams brings that, WM does as well, and MM to some extent. I do not rate morales but he certainly bring that nastiness that JK talks about. With the last 2 yrs he should have been called in over the MLS guys. I have said I never want to see Jozy again based on him jogging vs TT-

But where we have to be careful is US love guys who "try hard" there is a difference to having nastiness vs trying hard and playing with heart. Yes most of our team looked indifferent vs Canada but what we do not need is guys like: Wondo, Zardes, Ariola, Bedoya Zusi, who played bc they run and run run and they chase every ball.
We need guys like the younger bradley who would tackle you, guys like Jermaine jones who didn't take any shit BUT who had skill -I want our team to have heart but also technical skill-

So is MLS the only problem NO. Do they hurt the game for the others yep. Its telling that Reyna went overseas when his dad works for an MLS team-his dad knew what was best for his son, that is get to a place where you can play with the best everyday. I would argue that an overseas practice is as intense as the avg mls game. and you have 5 guys behind you are just as good as you so if you mess up in practice you are gone. MlS has no depth-

The problem is MLS, Greg, player selection, US Soccer, youth system, pay to play, scouting new players, pride
Stoked
blaise213
Post #103
Monday October 21, 2019 12:54am

Joined Sep 2012
Total Posts: 3,023
Original post from stoked3

My post was referencing how Josh Sargaent, CP, Matt M, Yedlin, all went back to their clubs and played well this weekend-yet they looked lost vs Canada. That tells us alot, some players they play with from mls are mentally and tactically behind. It also tells us that GB was outcoached bc the other team had alot of mls players.

Zack Steffan was interviewed in Germany and he said GB system is so complex that guys are not playing with instinct and skill, rather they are out there trying to think what to do in a system.

Mckenzie plays really well for his Club rarely this yr has he looked out of place. JS dropped back v Canada bc there was no service. CP played horrible you could tell he was sick-GB should not have played him-CP looked like he was playing not to get hurt v cuba bc he realized it was a stupid game -he should not have played that game either. That should have been a game to play younger players. Aronson etc

The problem with the Nat is certianly partly MLS. Jordan Morris is a great example-he could take his career to the next level and go overseas but he is in a league where he will be praised week in and out and no one will ever push him for his spot. He is in a system with US soccer that says if you get called up from MLS you generally get called up-he comes back from being injured and is out for 18 months and he gets called in after 1 game? But the argument against Williams, holmes has been injuries so we can't bring them in.

There is not 1 problem with the Nats but MLS is a big part of it. Since bradley came back he has been in a decline, some of that is age, some of it is he is no longer pushed-Jozy had to leave overseas bc he is not on that level.

You have Long who would benefit greatly by going overseas yet MLS didn't let him go, now we have Paxton who just signed to stay.

So back to your comments. No our Euro guys didnt look good, but CP was taking 4 to 5 guys on at once, WM had no one next to him (I didn't even know Roldon was on the field) JS didn't have service etc

I was for giving GB a chance but he has proven to be an idiot. If you think I am totally against mls that is not the case, I listed guys in a dif post who should have played and or should be called in from MLS BUT GB just picks the same guys.

Good Example : Sebastian L-if you are trying to play possession how does he sit the bench and Roldon start? I actually rate SL and think he has a place on the team, he has technical skills-he can trap the ball you can tell he played overseas. What has Roldon shown you to make you think he should even recalled into camp cupcake-

Where I do agree with you is the Nats lacks bite- I believe Adams brings that, WM does as well, and MM to some extent. I do not rate morales but he certainly bring that nastiness that JK talks about. With the last 2 yrs he should have been called in over the MLS guys. I have said I never want to see Jozy again based on him jogging vs TT-

But where we have to be careful is US love guys who "try hard" there is a difference to having nastiness vs trying hard and playing with heart. Yes most of our team looked indifferent vs Canada but what we do not need is guys like: Wondo, Zardes, Ariola, Bedoya Zusi, who played bc they run and run run and they chase every ball.
We need guys like the younger bradley who would tackle you, guys like Jermaine jones who didn't take any shit BUT who had skill -I want our team to have heart but also technical skill-

So is MLS the only problem NO. Do they hurt the game for the others yep. Its telling that Reyna went overseas when his dad works for an MLS team-his dad knew what was best for his son, that is get to a place where you can play with the best everyday. I would argue that an overseas practice is as intense as the avg mls game. and you have 5 guys behind you are just as good as you so if you mess up in practice you are gone. MlS has no depth-

The problem is MLS, Greg, player selection, US Soccer, youth system, pay to play, scouting new players, pride


Post of the mother f***** Year !!!

BMD15
Boston
Post #104
Monday October 21, 2019 1:39am

Joined Oct 2015
Total Posts: 148
Original post from stoked3
Zack Steffan was interviewed in Germany and he said GB system is so complex that guys are not playing with instinct and skill, rather they are out there trying to think what to do in a system.


I'd love to read that if you can find the interview/article you're referencing. Did a quick search but didn't find it at a cursory glance.
NETID
bjelks
Post #105
Monday October 21, 2019 2:40am

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 1,414
Original post from Kamphgruppe

You guys talk about accountability but won't admit when your pets don't play well.
So let me get this straight, if we lose no matter what it's the MLS guys fault. If the MLS guys play great and score all the goals it's only because of the Euro guys.

Look I am not really an MLS guy but your hatred of the league borders on delusional.


I want to see Pom, I want to see Keaton, I want to see Cannon, I want to see Ferraira and Toye.
I'll take a look at Mikes Rob.
But I can't stomach another Bradley, Roldan, Lovitz, Zardes, Ream game.

And I don't believe in Long or Morris.
They're serviceable but nothing special
goalsense
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