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cudevil
Post #16
Monday July 15, 2019 7:51pm

Joined Oct 2012
Total Posts: 920
Original post from Lilshmike

Yes, but you have to do something at the club level in order to warrant being called into camp in the first place...


No, not really. That's never been anything more than a guideline, at best. Look at Jonathan Lewis and Jordan Morris coming back from injury as the most recent examples. Generally, club performance is a reasonable proxy as to whether someone is ready to play for the senior team. But not always (see e.g. Tim Chandler).

Fact is, we are in a developmental period. We should be bringing in guys that are making the bench or appear to be in line for first team minutes to see whether they can play at the international level. If they can, keep running them out there. It can only help their club career as well.

cudevil
Post #17
Monday July 15, 2019 7:54pm

Joined Oct 2012
Total Posts: 920
Original post from hamsamwich

Also Zardes is the least concern of the three musketeers that are Greggs boys. I'd say Trapp and Omar have to go yesterday.


Zardes is a pretty big concern. He offers almost nothing if he can't finish. At least Jozy can hold the ball up, draw a foul, and pick some passes.

blaise213
Post #18
Monday July 15, 2019 9:07pm

Joined Sep 2012
Total Posts: 2,908
A roster that MLS would never approve:

F: Weah, Sargent, Wooten, Johansson
LW: Pulisic, Soto
RW: Boyd, De la Fuente
MF: Holmes, Reyna, Pomykal, Adams, Sonora
LB: Robinson
RB; Dest, Yedlin
CB: Brooks, Miazga, Richards, Long
G: Steffan + 2

(Sorry McKennie)
Honorable mention: Sabbi, Wright, Nova, Saief
Dual Nationals: Tillman, Sebatcheau, E Alvarez

db707
Post #19
Monday July 15, 2019 9:27pm

Joined Oct 2013
Total Posts: 948
blaise, which Sonora? Both? Also too many of those players are old enough to drive. Try harder.

bjelks
Post #20
Monday July 15, 2019 10:08pm

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 1,221
Soto is a 9 not a wing
De La Fuente wasn't even good in the U20s
Your hate for Mckennie is laughable (arguably our 3rd best player)
How is Wooten rated higher than Nova?
Gio hasn't even played a u19 game yet
goalsense
navi8132
New York
Post #21
Monday July 15, 2019 11:46pm

Joined Jul 2012
Total Posts: 3,095
Soto also wasn't good in the U20's (he did not look comfortable with the ball at his feet).

blaise213
Post #22
Tuesday July 16, 2019 12:08am

Joined Sep 2012
Total Posts: 2,908
Original post from navi8132

Soto also wasn't good in the U20's (he did not look comfortable with the ball at his feet).


Sounds like every MLS player

blaise213
Post #23
Tuesday July 16, 2019 12:27am

Joined Sep 2012
Total Posts: 2,908
Original post from db707

blaise, which Sonora? Both? Also too many of those players are old enough to drive. Try harder.


Joel Sonora! Whose the other one ?

hamsamwich
Post #24
Tuesday July 16, 2019 12:54am

Joined Oct 2013
Total Posts: 3,138
Wooten and Pomykal are mls approved at least bud. I'm definitely calling for Gloster to be included, he can play and grew up as a CB if GGG wants to stick with the stay at home LB.

2tone
Ten-Towns
Post #25
Tuesday July 16, 2019 1:12am

Joined Jul 2012
Total Posts: 10,346
New faces I definitely want to see in the September callups:

D: Dest, Gloster
M: Pomykal, Servania
A: Toye, Alan Sonora

And then obviously young guys

Adams, Weah, Sargent, Nova, McKennie, Pulisic, Boyd etc....

Kamphgruppe
Michigan
Post #26
Tuesday July 16, 2019 1:13am

Joined Jul 2012
Total Posts: 794
Original post from blaise213

A roster that MLS would never approve:

F: Weah, Sargent, Wooten, Johansson
LW: Pulisic, Soto
RW: Boyd, De la Fuente
MF: Holmes, Reyna, Pomykal, Adams, Sonora
LB: Robinson
RB; Dest, Yedlin
CB: Brooks, Miazga, Richards, Long
G: Steffan + 2

(Sorry McKennie)
Honorable mention: Sabbi, Wright, Nova, Saief
Dual Nationals: Tillman, Sebatcheau, E Alvarez


Do we always have to do the MLS vs not MLS thing? How about regardless of where they play here are the guys I would like to see called in. I would love to see some of our U20 players get a callup, Dest, Reyna, Soto and want to see Holmes, Pomykal and Sargent too.

blaise213
Post #27
Tuesday July 16, 2019 1:45am

Joined Sep 2012
Total Posts: 2,908
Original post from Kamphgruppe

Do we always have to do the MLS vs not MLS thing? How about regardless of where they play here are the guys I would like to see called in. I would love to see some of our U20 players get a callup, Dest, Reyna, Soto and want to see Holmes, Pomykal and Sargent too.


Yeah did you not see the MLS style vs Mexico?

✔️Long balls
✔️Back passes under pressure
✔️not using their chest to bring down the ball to maintain possession
✔️no 1vs1 attacking
✔️ Shit finishing

Do you not notice this ?

db707
Post #28
Tuesday July 16, 2019 2:35am

Joined Oct 2013
Total Posts: 948
Original post from blaise213

Joel Sonora! Whose the other one ?


Joel's brother Alan, also in Argentina at Independiente.

Lilshmike
Post #29
Tuesday July 16, 2019 2:54pm

Joined Oct 2012
Total Posts: 1,167
Original post from cudevil

No, not really. That's never been anything more than a guideline, at best. Look at Jonathan Lewis and Jordan Morris coming back from injury as the most recent examples. Generally, club performance is a reasonable proxy as to whether someone is ready to play for the senior team. But not always (see e.g. Tim Chandler).

Fact is, we are in a developmental period. We should be bringing in guys that are making the bench or appear to be in line for first team minutes to see whether they can play at the international level. If they can, keep running them out there. It can only help their club career as well.
First thing first - if they aren't able to crack it at the club level, then they aren't able to hack it at the international level. Period. If that changes, yes, call them in. But if they can't even make the field for their club team then they should be nowhere near the USMNT.

Next - developmental period? Thats a bit off. Players who were on the team in previous cycles now, who are in the age range where they will/may still be in the picture come 2022:
  • Brooks
  • Yedlin
  • Altidore
  • Bradley
  • Miazga
  • Arriola
  • Zardes (I don't like him, but still hes earned the right to be in the conversation)
  • Morris (he has been around, was the next big thing before staying in MLS and getting hurt, and will continue to be in the picture moving forward like it or not)
  • Wood (although he wasn't in the GC and hasn't been in form, still counts)
Then throw in the newer, emerging, seemingly locked in players:
  • Pulisic
  • McKennie
  • Adams
  • Boyd
  • Long
  • Steffen
  • Horvath
We could throw Zimmerman into that convo as well. Including Zim, thats 17 names. Out of a roster of 23... what is so developmental about 5 open slots (excluding the 3rd goalkeeper)?

This is normal. We have a few slots where we can rotate in kids to give them a shot when they've earned it. Over time, some may push out the guys listed/in front of them, or they may not.

We aren't really in a developmental phase. We missed the WC in 2018, and so did other big time national teams. People take this as some monumental issue - and although it wasn't ideal and was embarrassing, statistically it is bound to happen every once in a while.

With respect to our pool, some guys phased out, some guys phased in. Look at the numbers - this isn't unusual and its not like we are in some crisis where we need to start over with an entirely new roster of players.

As stated before, people are splitting hairs over a few bench/fringe/roster spots. When you objectively look at our pool and analyze it for what it is on a positional basis... thats exactly what it is - a few bench spots. That can certainly change throughout qualifying, but its up to the younger players to prove they deserve to be in the camps through their club form/performances - not the USMNT manager to force in a bunch of young guys, who may or may not be ready or pan out, in the name of potential or development.

bjelks
Post #30
Tuesday July 16, 2019 5:05pm

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 1,221
The problem is all clubs and leagues aren't created equal. Just because Josh Sargent or Tim Weah aren't everyday starters at WB and Lille doesn't mean they aren't better players than Jozy, Zardes, Arriola and Morris.
Also, we have a guy like Morales who started half of his team's games in the Bundesliga who can't invited to a 40 man camp.

Also, don't think ppl are splitting hairs over a few bench spots. Ppl are splitting hairs over continuing to recall players who underperform with very low ceilings. Ppl are also splitting hairs over starting spots that are given to the coach's boys instead of giving better players an opportunity to even earn the spot.
goalsense
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