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stoked3
Ft Lauderdale, FL
Post #106
Monday October 8, 2018 3:06am

Joined Oct 2014
Total Posts: 252
Original post from Lilshmike

Unfortunately, Altidore is still one of our best strikers. Sargent is not. Again, the kid has yet to play full professional. Up to this point, his only experience is against youth and reserve team players. He has potential, yes, but right now he isn't there until he starts getting games at Bremen.


I don't want to see Jozy anywhere near the program-we have enough talented kids coming up the ranks who we should give PT too.

Sure jozy should have a place on the team but to many times you would catch him giving a half ass performance.

I still can't believe he was jogging around the field while we were losing to T&T-no urgency just comfortable to trot along as we lost. That mentality is not needed--you can be talented but also a determinant to the team.

We are turning a page and guys like-adams, mckinnie , MM, etc bring attitude to the team..
Stoked
bjelks
Post #107
Monday October 8, 2018 5:18am

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 796
Honestly I don't think he does anything better than the top 5 fwds in the pool
goalsense
bjelks
Post #108
Monday October 8, 2018 5:21am

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 796
And Lichaj played in the premier league 5 yrs ago, Gooch played 2 yrs ago
goalsense
db707
Post #109
Monday October 8, 2018 6:49am

Joined Oct 2013
Total Posts: 723
Original post from bjelks
That's an American thing, keeping players proven to fail, hoping they'll get better.


Unlike a bjelks thing, treating players who have proven nothing as if they have proven something, usually because they are on the books in a mediocre league in Europe.

blaise213
Post #110
Monday October 8, 2018 8:24am

Joined Sep 2012
Total Posts: 2,710
Wow great news for MLS

Delgado in, McKennie out...

@Bjelks

Saw on the MLS article about Delgado, some dude named Karun Sagar was talking about Alfredo Morales being snubbed, lol that you ?

Lilshmike
Post #111
Monday October 8, 2018 11:26am

Joined Oct 2012
Total Posts: 870
@bjelks

Jozy is one of our top 5 forwards. I challenge you to find any analyst, media, prior USMNT player who says otherwise.

I'm glad you were able to lookup Lichaj on Wikipedia after stating he had never played in a top league. Also, Lichaj plays in Championship now, while Gooch plays in 3rd tier League One... he is a starter playing week in and week out in a better league... again, your arguments are working against you.

Lilshmike
Post #112
Monday October 8, 2018 11:56am

Joined Oct 2012
Total Posts: 870
@stoked3

What you, and most other people on this site, are failing to realize is that I'm not advocating for Jozy. I'm simply stating the truth. The statement, "unfortunately, Altidore is still one of our best strikers" is backhanded towards Altidore. I dont think hes that great, and I wish we had better forwards, but we dont. Truly... we dont. I'm not a huge fan, and if I were manager I probably wouldnt start him, but if we are playing in a competitive game, he should be in the 23 man roster. I'll challenge you as well to find any analyst, media personnel, or former player who says otherwise.

The difference between what I, and what most others on this site are doing, is that I am looking at our pool from a realistic standpoint and analyzing it for what it is. Yeah, we have a number of up and coming players... but they haven't done or proven anything yet. To make a claim that a kid who plays reserve team soccer in the 4th tier of a foreign country - who nobody has been able to truly analyze outside of select highlights (which can be cherry picked) and him playing against 17 and 18 year olds - is better than a starter in MLS who scores consistently is a joke. Like really... it is.

Sargent is just one example of the ridiculousness that gets thrown out here. I could easily list a dozen players pumped on the boards who were promising like that who haven't panned out and are nothing now. Trust me, I want all these kids to pan out and be good players for us... but they just aren't there yet. And thinking otherwise is a fantasy and not reality.

To foster a good mentality, are you going to make the players earn their spot and fight for their position in the team based on consistent criteria (ie club playing time and form), or just give spots away to youth players with the blind hope and expectation that it may help their development? Again, let's look at the reality... national teams typically aren't responsible for developing talent. Clubs are.

Certainly there are exceptions to any rule, but if someone isn't at least starting, getting minutes, and/or producing at a level/league at least on par with MLS, then they should not be given special treatment over anyone in MLS who is. That's pretty simple. And half the guys that people bring up on the boards here legitimately are not at that level or point in their careers yet.

bjelks
Post #113
Monday October 8, 2018 1:04pm

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 796
Original post from Lilshmike

@bjelks

Jozy is one of our top 5 forwards. I challenge you to find any analyst, media, prior USMNT player who says otherwise.

I'm glad you were able to lookup Lichaj on Wikipedia after stating he had never played in a top league. Also, Lichaj plays in Championship now, while Gooch plays in 3rd tier League One... he is a starter playing week in and week out in a better league... again, your arguments are working against you.


I'm sorry Lichaj played in the premier league so long ago that I forgot lol. And again Gooch isn't playing in league one because he's not good enough for a higher league, he is because he wants to bring his club back up that he's loyal to, but you wouldn't understand a fighting mentality because there's no pro/ rel in mls.
I've also stated that Gooch plays a position that we're very thin at behind Pulisic and Gooch is also a young player with room to grow.
Lichaj plays a position where we have younger options at the same level or higher.

Nobody has given me a Jozy argument around his level of play or ability, just what he did 4-5 yrs ago lol. The level of fanboydem and lack of actual ability to evaluate soccer in US is ridiculous.
US has the softest and homer friendly soccer media in the world, I'm not listening to those hacks lie about how good their friends and employers' are.
US Media outlets will not allow someone publicly speak ill on a federation golden boy or coaching decision on tv.
goalsense
db707
Post #114
Monday October 8, 2018 1:28pm

Joined Oct 2013
Total Posts: 723
bjelks, for all you know Gooch has a girlfriend in Sunderland and she wants him to stay there. You don't know a thing about why he's really still there. All I know is it's hurting his development as a player to be playing against Plymouth Argyle and Shrewsbury Town. You've got to be loyal to yourself first and foremost in your career. He can't be lauded for being "loyal" while a guy like Morris gets slagged for staying in MLS.

Lilshmike
Post #115
Monday October 8, 2018 2:17pm

Joined Oct 2012
Total Posts: 870
@bjelks

Seriously though, what are you talking about? Loyalty? Not understanding the mentality of pro/rel? MLS fanboydem and homers? Lying hacks?

Haha you sound like a kid in college who just took philosophy 101 and now has a profound understanding of the world...

hamsamwich
Post #116
Monday October 8, 2018 3:03pm

Joined Oct 2013
Total Posts: 2,767
For all the people who wanted two players replaced by two players, we have Marky Delgado. He's kind of a slick player, not bad. But seems like a practice player to me. As for Morales- I suppose we could have brought him in but I think he's going to play the 6 in the European based games.

Again, players with miles on their legs like aren't here (Cameron, Ream, Morales, Lichaj, Altidore, Zardes (the veterans), and the injured (Pulisic, Adams, McKennie), and a few who could be there if healthy (Williams, Stanko, Johansson)... these are pretty much the best 23. Seeing what Cannon does vs Moore, or Sweat vs Villafaña, or say Amon on the wing vs what we've seen previously. It's experimentation time and we still have no future coach. It's kind of hard to argue with the players Dave Sarachan has brought in. Gall being an omission for now- he still has the November games in Europe where I see him getting some run- the rest of the team has picked itself especially with the injuries.

As others have said, the pool is inexperienced and the older players don't have "it". Gotta say it stinks to watch these games without McKennie, Adams or Pulisic. I guess we can watch our CB partnership grow through adversity- as it's hard to see USA slowing down Colombia with our current XI. Feels like Acosta has a chance to show what he has to the fans and scouts. Him and Julian Green better show up or we look stale.

bjelks
Post #117
Monday October 8, 2018 3:33pm

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 796
@lilshmike you just said to foster a good mentality and make players earn their spot you should
pick guys that flopped in Europe and came back to mls to coast over someone with more ability, much younger, playing under more pressure and in a more competitive environment lmao.
Like Jermaine Jones said, taking the easy Route is the American way and the main reason we're behind.
He also said good players come to mls to retire and a 20 yr old in Europe has a tougher mentality and better tactical understanding than a 25 yr old in mls.
@lilshmike you sound like you don't care how the us program performs as long as they pick mls guys and vets to the national team no matter their actual ability, which is a big reason this program has a hard time moving fwd, promoting mediocrity and not holding ppl accountable for failure.

This is why jozy is so lazy and soft, because someone like you keeps telling him he's good and belongs in natl team for no reason lol.
goalsense
Kamphgruppe
Michigan
Post #118
Monday October 8, 2018 5:17pm

Joined Jul 2012
Total Posts: 653
Original post from bjelks

You are laughable and it's ppl making decisions that think like you is the reason no one outside of America respects American soccer.
It's that same mls arrogance that is the reason we didn't qualify.


Actually it's people like you that are the reason we didn't qualify. We qualified for years with hard work, heart, and a never say die attitude. People like you believe that the American way is inferior and we must bow to everything European. Look where abandoning our roots got us! Not qualifying for the first time since 1990. We have so many skilled young players emerging, it would have been great to see them with both great skill and great heart.
Also, blanket statements like, "no one outside of America respects American soccer" just make you look foolish.

bjelks
Post #119
Monday October 8, 2018 6:28pm

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 796
@kamphgruppe. Smh "we qualified with hard work..." sounds ridiculous. Players play the game and 10 times out of 9 if your players aren't good enough they won't win. When your manager who was American intentionally picks players that aren't good enough because of an agenda to promote mls guys and Guys that developed the "American way" it makes the game that much more difficult for guys that are. Have you ever played the game before lol?

We didn't abandon any roots, we had the manager MLS fanboys wanted and relied on washed up guys the federation developed. Look at us now, our interim manager who is a tool of the "American way" is deploying a captain that isn't good enough to play on a bottom table team in any top league. We have a CM who plays in a top league (Morales) who is snubbed because the federation and tool coach won't leave off a good ole boy Trapp, Bradley for some one not affiliated with MLS or US federation development.

We have a dysfunctional pay to play development system that keeps inner city kids and minorities out of the game and we have foolish fanboys like you that think if we have 11 Bradleys, Trapps, and Altidores and if they just played with more heart they could compete with world powers like Brasil, France, Spain who have better athletes, more skill, and understanding of tactics. That is most ridiculous thing I've heard on this board.

And I agree we have young studs like Pulisic, Mckennie, Adams, Brooks, Miazga, Saief who are proven at high club levels and have world class talent, but to think they're cut from the same cloth as Bradley, Trapp, Altidore is insane.
goalsense
Lilshmike
Post #120
Monday October 8, 2018 7:11pm

Joined Oct 2012
Total Posts: 870
Original post from bjelks

@lilshmike you just said to foster a good mentality and make players earn their spot you should
pick guys that flopped in Europe and came back to mls to coast over someone with more ability, much younger, playing under more pressure and in a more competitive environment lmao.
Really, is that what I said? Wow... I must have missed that. I mean, I would never use lmao in a sentence...

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