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2tone
Ten-Towns
Post #1
Tuesday July 31, 2018 8:24pm

Joined Jul 2012
Total Posts: 9,631
So with the u20 World Cup and Gold Cup happening next summer there will be a player conundrum.

Adams, Sargent, Weah, Amon, and Tillman all have the potential of playing either with the USMNT for the Gold Cup or for the U20's at the WC. Would you rather see these players with the Gold Cup team or with the U20 team?

All of these players are potentially first team players or already first team players for their respected teams.

Should be interesting to see what happens.

Lilshmike
Post #2
Tuesday July 31, 2018 8:38pm

Joined Oct 2012
Total Posts: 624
I'd personally like to see as many of them with the U-20s as possible for that tournament. Especially since we have seen a few of them with the full senior team already. Use the Gold cup for integrating/evaluating older domestic-based players and fringe guys.

It would be nice to have some success with the YNT. If these young guys are as good as we think they are/could be, then they should have a good shot to go deep in that tournament.

navi8132
New York
Post #3
Tuesday July 31, 2018 9:06pm

Joined Jul 2012
Total Posts: 2,971
The following applies only to our U-20 players who are NOT at a big club: U20 World Cup is more important due to the scouting by euro clubs there. Gold Cup is a cash grab for US Soccer.

db707
Post #4
Tuesday July 31, 2018 9:14pm

Joined Oct 2013
Total Posts: 575
This is also the Gold Cup with everyone bringing their full teams (no Confed Cup conflict). Given that we haven't won under that scenario since 2007, and we can qualify for the Confed Cup if we win (a lesser tournament, yes, but can't hurt to be in it, especially if we have a younger team), I prioritize the Gold Cup.

If those guys are good enough and playing for their clubs enough, U-20 starts so early (May 23) I don't think it would be the right place for them, they'd want to be with their clubs into May and nats in June. If they're not playing for club, then they should be at the U-20. We'll see how much playing time they get. Side note: I was happy to see they made the Gold Cup 16 teams. It's the right number I feel.

Know Nothing
Post #5
Tuesday July 31, 2018 9:49pm

Joined Jan 2013
Total Posts: 1,381
If they are established with their clubs let them play in the Gold Cup...having as many U-23 players in that side would be helpful building continuity for when Olympic qualifying occurs in October.

2tone
Ten-Towns
Post #6
Tuesday July 31, 2018 10:36pm

Joined Jul 2012
Total Posts: 9,631
I think you will see Sargent, Weah, and Amon with the U20's. Tillman and Adams with the full team.

Dave
Post #7
Wednesday August 1, 2018 2:37am

Joined Jul 2014
Total Posts: 884
What many forget is that clubs are not required to release players for youth national team competitions, but they are required to release players for Sr. National team games that are on FIFA dates. While MLS clubs will usually release players, EU Clubs tend not to...remember McKennie & Pulisic last cycle.
So if a player is age eligible for the U-20s and is either with his clubs 1st team or close to it, their club may not be willing to risk releasing them for a Youth Tournament. This would potentially apply to players like: Weah, Adams, Sargent, De La Torre, Amon, etc....
If this is likely the case (their not being released) than they should be called in for the Gold Cup at the Sr. level.....so long as they are worthy of a call-up.

We don't need to see "Old Fringe Guys"....Lichaj, Morales, Howard, Dempsey, Ream, Cameron, etc....
We need to be building towards the future with players who are relevant now & and will remain relevant for the future....Adams, Weah, Pulisic, etc...

2tone
Ten-Towns
Post #8
Wednesday August 1, 2018 4:46am

Joined Jul 2012
Total Posts: 9,631
De la Torre isn't u20 eligible.

bjelks
Post #9
Wednesday August 1, 2018 6:32am

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 588
Morales is still in the Bundesliga, the other old guys are not
goalsense
db707
Post #10
Wednesday August 1, 2018 7:57am

Joined Oct 2013
Total Posts: 575
Original post from bjelks

Morales is still in the Bundesliga, the other old guys are not


Ream's in the Premier League, if he's starting for Fulham all year he's in the conversation for the Gold Cup, for sure.

hamsamwich
Post #11
Wednesday August 1, 2018 2:30pm

Joined Oct 2013
Total Posts: 2,616
The u20 World Cup is mostly for scouting like someone just said. We have more youth guys that still need a look and the ones who are full usmnt players should stay with the full team. There are plenty of guys that aren't full starters who should be there.

Bigger countries have so many better players that it's hard for the kids to break through and so the u20 gives them a platform. In the USA our senior team is so bad we've turned the page and given those same age kids (who would be u20 elsewhere) the keys to the full team. No sense rewinding that, let's add to it.

Lilshmike
Post #12
Wednesday August 1, 2018 2:59pm

Joined Oct 2012
Total Posts: 624
Original post from Dave

What many forget is that clubs are not required to release players for youth national team competitions, but they are required to release players for Sr. National team games that are on FIFA dates. While MLS clubs will usually release players, EU Clubs tend not to...remember McKennie & Pulisic last cycle.
So if a player is age eligible for the U-20s and is either with his clubs 1st team or close to it, their club may not be willing to risk releasing them for a Youth Tournament. This would potentially apply to players like: Weah, Adams, Sargent, De La Torre, Amon, etc....
If this is likely the case (their not being released) than they should be called in for the Gold Cup at the Sr. level.....so long as they are worthy of a call-up.

We don't need to see "Old Fringe Guys"....Lichaj, Morales, Howard, Dempsey, Ream, Cameron, etc....
We need to be building towards the future with players who are relevant now & and will remain relevant for the future....Adams, Weah, Pulisic, etc...
Just to clarify, older fringe players means guys who are older than 20, thus not qualifying for that tournament, and who have not gotten a look at the senior team yet.

Lilshmike
Post #13
Wednesday August 1, 2018 3:03pm

Joined Oct 2012
Total Posts: 624
Original post from db707

This is also the Gold Cup with everyone bringing their full teams (no Confed Cup conflict). Given that we haven't won under that scenario since 2007, and we can qualify for the Confed Cup if we win (a lesser tournament, yes, but can't hurt to be in it, especially if we have a younger team), I prioritize the Gold Cup.

If those guys are good enough and playing for their clubs enough, U-20 starts so early (May 23) I don't think it would be the right place for them, they'd want to be with their clubs into May and nats in June. If they're not playing for club, then they should be at the U-20. We'll see how much playing time they get. Side note: I was happy to see they made the Gold Cup 16 teams. It's the right number I feel.
Qualification for the Confederations Cup from CONCACAF now consists of a playoff between the winners of the two Gold Cups. It is no longer a one off tournament.

Not only that, but the rumor is that the Confederations Cup is going to be scrapped in favor of a more official, expanded FIFA Club World Cup occurring every 4 years. If there is a Confederations Cup this next time around, it will likely be the last.

db707
Post #14
Wednesday August 1, 2018 3:06pm

Joined Oct 2013
Total Posts: 575
Original post from Lilshmike

Qualification for the Confederations Cup from CONCACAF now consists of a playoff between the winners of the two Gold Cups. It is no longer a one off tournament.

Not only that, but the rumor is that the Confederations Cup is going to be scrapped in favor of a more official, expanded FIFA Club World Cup occurring every 4 years. If there is a Confederations Cup this next time around, it will likely be the last.


But we won the last Gold Cup, so we'd qualify automatically if we win the next one. Yeah, the Confed Cup doesn't really mean much these days, I wouldn't be surprised to see it die.

Lilshmike
Post #15
Wednesday August 1, 2018 3:17pm

Joined Oct 2012
Total Posts: 624
Original post from db707

But we won the last Gold Cup, so we'd qualify automatically if we win the next one. Yeah, the Confed Cup doesn't really mean much these days, I wouldn't be surprised to see it die.
Fair point.

I'd really like to see CONCACAF scrap the 2nd Gold Cup, only have 1 every cycle, and substitute the second with an intercontinental tournament with CONMEBOL (like the Copa America Centenario)


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