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bjelks
Post #46
Saturday April 14, 2018 5:33pm

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 546
- I think Greg Garza is solid but I don't know if he's better than Antoine Robinson. Truth be told Tim Chandler is our best LB right now.

- I'm sorry I haven't heard a good reason not to invite Alfredo Morales to camp. We simply do not have the quality at DM to ignore a Bundesliga player in his prime. You can tell me he's not that good, but Beckerman wasn't that good, neither was Dax Mccarty, Bedoya, Zusi, Omar G.
He can't be worse than those guys and start in Bundesliga. So there's hypocrisy in that theory.

- Regarding Trapp, Roldan, and Delgado, the professional football world recognizes 23+ as a fully developed football player. Two of those guys are 22 and the other 25. My pt is those guys don't have the chops for international play and they aren't likely to get better. Again their age, isn't a viable reason to pick them over Morales.

- The only justifiable reasons I'm buying for not playing in Europe are youth and MLS contract restrictions. If the priority isn't playing at the highest possible level to push your career forward, you don't have the right mentality for intl football.

- If a player plays in Bundesliga 3 under extinuating circumstances like Gyau and you know he has high potential, he should get an opportunity to compete with a young player with a lower ceiling like Delgado. If Bundesliga 2 player is playing regularly, he has to get an opportunity to compete with MLS guys. Because if history holds up, the Bundesliga 2 are more likely to play in Bundesliga 1 and make an impact internationally.

- The whole notion that we have some stable of proven players is a joke lol. All those MLS proven players from the last cycle were failures because they were washed or never had it.
Pullisic, Mckennie, Adams, Saief, Yedlin, Chandler, Miazga, Brooks, CCV, Ream should be automatically included in a competitive game. The rest are up for debate.
goalsense
Dave
Post #47
Saturday April 14, 2018 9:26pm

Joined Jul 2014
Total Posts: 870
@bjelks - I understand what you are saying, and will agree with you up to a point. I don't think that players like Trapp, Roldan, & Delgado are the answer to some of our positional questions/needs. Nor am I against the inclusion of some "Older" players (Villafana, Williams, Morales, Boyd, ArJo, etc...) if they play a position of need. Especially if they were not given much of a chance/opportunity under JK/Bruce.
That being said there is a clear "Bell Curve" associated to field player development. The period of time up to 24 is when most players are gaining experience and understanding. Then a Plateau period of performance 24-29 where physical ability & experience allows for their peak level of play. Followed by a general decline in play 30-34. Morales (27) & Williams (28) are currently at their Plateaus. They could provide something to the team right now, but they are not likely to contribute for long.

IMO, at this moment the focus for the USMNT CM positions (6 & 8) should be on McKennie (19), Adams (19), K. Acosta (22), Parks (20). These are the players we should be building around. If these 4 are not available, or in form, than add from the fringe player pool (Older: Williams, Morales, Stanko, Trapp & Younger: Delgado Roldan, Jones). Until such time as we have a Competitive game again, I would be more inclined to give the nod to a young player than an Older player, since these games don't mean anything.

As for your last statement..."the whole notion that we have some stable of proven players is a joke". You are 100% accurate. We have a handful of players who should be INKED into the squad right now: Pulisic, Brooks, Yedlin, McKennie, Adams, Miazga, & Saief.
We've got a handful of names that should be in PENCIL on the squad (on the roster so long as they perform): Steffen, Hamid, Chandler, CCV, Villafana, K. Acosta, Arriola, Delgado, & Wood. These are all players who've either shown enough at their clubs or in recent appearances with the USMNT recently to claim a preliminary spot on a 23 man roster.
Everyone else is auditioning for a possible roster spot. Parks, Scott, Robinson, Moore, Manneh, Weah, Sargent, and a number of others are all showing promise/potential and need to be tried over a couple of camps/games. I guess that is why I am so interested in what the squad will be for the 3 matches in May/June. It will be an extended run of friendlies where coaches & players will get a real chance to show what their abilities are.

hamsamwich
Post #48
Thursday April 19, 2018 12:08am

Joined Oct 2013
Total Posts: 2,594
This feels like a lame duck period jeez.

navi8132
New York
Post #49
Thursday April 19, 2018 12:27am

Joined Jul 2012
Total Posts: 2,951
Original post from hamsamwich

This feels like a lame duck period jeez.


It's felt like a lame duck period for many years now sadly.....

Rey Regicide
Post #50
Thursday April 19, 2018 2:39pm

Joined Sep 2013
Total Posts: 2,001
Honestly there's no movements, no motivations until 2019 or until the youth start getting those games.

If Weah, Andrea, Sargent, Tatigue, De La Torre etc the next generation start getting professional game time then all our friendlies become a cause of excitement.

The portugal game was great because regardless how you feel about them, even with a decimated lineup (which at this point really just means Brooks an d Pulisic aren't there) Mckennie, Adams etc got some run. Those are exciting players who are young (UNDER 20 CRAZY) and must see US MNT tv. But if Mckennie and Adams regress to the point where they're not getting games. Then we're stuck with Trapp, Roladn etc from the MLS. Or worse yet, calling in Bradley Altidore the "established" old guard. I mean this is our reality, it sucks, but our reality is a bit tough at the moment.

I TOTALLY understand Bjelks sentiment. A reduced professional environment like the MLS where people are handed professional spots in the form of a draft or totally subverted for south american talent who are acquired at a comparatively reduced rate, represents less of a measuring stick that hacking it out in Bundesliga 2. Or even being a 17 18 year old makin gfirst teams at PSG or Bayern Munich (when Julian Green was there). I totally favor this sentiment. But unfortunately USSF IS MLS. And we're not going get those dynamics in our national team.

Rey Regicide
Post #51
Tuesday April 24, 2018 7:00pm

Joined Sep 2013
Total Posts: 2,001
"Nagbe's play has been impressive when one considers the difference in tactics between his former and current club and how seamless the transition appears on the field. In Portland, he had more freedom to attack, as he often played alongside two defensive midfielders. In Atlanta however, Nagbe is asked to sit back more often, press the opposing backline when given the opportunity, and still attempt to find Atlanta's pacy attackers on a counter."

So.... central mid anyone? Maybe along side McKennie and Parks just occupying space leaving Saefi Puli and co. to do whatever they feel is right for attacking purposes up front.

Nagbe is the shield, Puli is the knife.

mandela
Post #52
Wednesday April 25, 2018 3:01am

Joined Dec 2013
Total Posts: 62
Original post from Rey Regicide

"Nagbe's play has been impressive when one considers the difference in tactics between his former and current club and how seamless the transition appears on the field. In Portland, he had more freedom to attack, as he often played alongside two defensive midfielders. In Atlanta however, Nagbe is asked to sit back more often, press the opposing backline when given the opportunity, and still attempt to find Atlanta's pacy attackers on a counter."

So.... central mid anyone? Maybe along side McKennie and Parks just occupying space leaving Saefi Puli and co. to do whatever they feel is right for attacking purposes up front.

Nagbe is the shield, Puli is the knife.


"The way that we play, being on the ball and wanting to be on the front foot the whole time and play attacking soccer, it's been great," Nagbe said. "I think initially I was just a little hesitant to go right for it and start pressing, but Gerardo [Martino, Atlanta's head coach], the coaching staff and my teammates have done a good job with me and have gotten me more accustomed to it."

it's funny because from this quote....it seems nagbe has been held back his whole career by pansy ass coaches....he describes his role with atlanta pretty much exactly opposite to your description....

i really think nagbe has suffered from some sub=par coaching in his career and will blossom under tata...and hopefully when the usmnt finally gets a world class coach....(but knowing what i do about ussf and mls and sum, i expect another lame us coach to be hired next)

Spank
661
Post #53
Wednesday April 25, 2018 6:03am

Joined Feb 2013
Total Posts: 119
You guys are nuts... no coach is unlocking any extra ability outta Nagbe. Not even a cheat code on FIFA.

Rey Regicide
Post #54
Wednesday April 25, 2018 2:49pm

Joined Sep 2013
Total Posts: 2,001
Right... from the quote they were talking about a defensive mindset. Putting pressure on the midfield in their half. That's implicitly "felt" as an attacking mindset. Like to attack them for their ball IS an attacking impetus. Nagbe isn't looking for killer balls in the box, or into the box. He's looking for killer possession in front of THEIR box.

And subsequently, to not panic and give the ball up in YOUR half, in front of your box, that's a defensive attribute. You keep the ball, nullify their ability to control the space up high and make your way slowly when there's no quick counter to build into an attack.

There's no unlocking Nagbe. There's putting him in your team and putting stuff around him so that you don't give up possession easily in your half.

I'm saying whenever you thought Nagbe was a 5, others felt differently. And that coaches like Tata are completely happy with his performance as a conduit rather than a point guard.

Rey Regicide
Post #55
Wednesday April 25, 2018 2:57pm

Joined Sep 2013
Total Posts: 2,001
Sometimes my friend and I would see Nagbe complete 90 percent of his passes and then read stuff online saying that he was too passive, not incisive, devoid of creating ideas. We'd look at each other and go, "Isn't that what Lletget, Pulisic are for?" When Nagbe is on the wing, and I've said this here, he most definitely becomes a dull knife. Because that position the way we line up, the winger IS the knife.

Nagbe is now occupying a spot in Atlanta where his contributions are appreciated and desired. Because Almiron, Martinez, Barco etc all those guys are pushing the envelope, taking risks, trying to cut you up. When they fail, it falls on Larentwoci the defense to cover, tackle and destroy and for Nagbe to be the outlet in that compartment.

I think we would do well to have that setup for our national team. Seeing how we have guys like adams mckennie pulisic and yes even Bradley who want to race through the space and build momentum forward. Nagbe wants no part of that. And that's where our numbers even out, and we don't expose ourselves to opponents attacks.

2tone
Ten-Towns
Post #56
Wednesday April 25, 2018 5:20pm

Joined Jul 2012
Total Posts: 9,536
Nagbe in my opinion is the closest player we have to a Pirloesque player. I want Nagbe on the USMNT because he rarely loses possession of the ball.

Wouldn't mind seeing this at some point:
--Insert striker---
---Pulisic---
Mckennie--Nagbe--

hamsamwich
Post #57
Thursday April 26, 2018 2:27am

Joined Oct 2013
Total Posts: 2,594
Jurgen tried this before guys - it WAS a thing and then it wasn't. I'm not really in favor of it as the other guys offer more in my opinion. But- he does still have time to contribute to a 2019 gold cup or copa squad.

hamsamwich
Post #58
Thursday April 26, 2018 2:43am

Joined Oct 2013
Total Posts: 2,594
Buried in Sarachans comments on Pulisic he said that Josh Sargent will be called up because "he's got a real chance".

bjelks
Post #59
Thursday April 26, 2018 5:47am

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 546
I'd rather see Green get a shot to pull the strings
goalsense
Rey Regicide
Post #60
Thursday April 26, 2018 12:48pm

Joined Sep 2013
Total Posts: 2,001
Pulling strings? What does that mean?

Pulisic pulls our strings. Nagbe offers them to him. ARe you saying you want GReen to offer strings to Pulisic?

I feel like that's a waste of Green's ability.

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