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cudevil
Post #181
Monday March 26, 2018 7:57pm

Joined Oct 2012
Total Posts: 994
Original post from bjelks

Us Soccer and US fans have to understand that a some time starter for a champions league team, a bench player for a Bundesliga team, and a starter for a Eredivise are all better than anyone on an MLS All-Star team.

Like Roldan or Trapp over Alfredo Morales makes no sense to anyone outside of MLS


Well, Morales is now a part time starter for an upper middle table 2.Bundesliga team, and never showed well in his USMNT appearances. Roldan/Trapp might not deserve a call up, but I don't see how Morales does either. And the notion that an MLS All-Star couldn't be better than Morales because he used to play in the Bundesliga is ridiculous. Or are you really going to tell me that Morales > Dempsey?

dfw_fan
DfW
Post #182
Monday March 26, 2018 11:09pm

Joined Apr 2013
Total Posts: 999
Original post from cudevil

Well, Morales is now a part time starter for an upper middle table 2.Bundesliga team, and never showed well in his USMNT appearances. Roldan/Trapp might not deserve a call up, but I don't see how Morales does either. And the notion that an MLS All-Star couldn't be better than Morales because he used to play in the Bundesliga is ridiculous. Or are you really going to tell me that Morales > Dempsey?


I would call Morales (Or Chandler) over most of the MLS players in the same position.


are you really going to tell me that Morales > Dempsey?


I didnt know they play the same position...

cudevil
Post #183
Monday March 26, 2018 11:32pm

Joined Oct 2012
Total Posts: 994
Original post from dfw_fan

I would call Morales (Or Chandler) over most of the MLS players in the same position.

I didnt know they play the same position...


Did you read bjelks post?

"Us Soccer and US fans have to understand that a some time starter for a champions league team, a bench player for a Bundesliga team, and a starter for a Eredivise are all better than anyone on an MLS All-Star team."

There's no distinction for position. But if you want to go on a comparison by position-Boyd > Dempsey?

Also, if he's giving credit to Morales because he was a starter in the Bundesliga, then he has to give similar benefit to Altidore and Bradley.

I wouldn't mind giving Chandler another shot. Morales doesn't move the meter for me at all. He was never good for the Nats. Chandler couldn't consistently re-create his club form for the USMNT, but had some good performances.

Frankly, neither should be in the mix right now. Both will be 32 by the time next WC rolls around-they aren't part of the future.

bjelks
Post #184
Monday March 26, 2018 11:46pm

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 1,372
I would absolutely call Boyd over Dempsey based on the fact that Boyd is playing in a tougher league than Dempsey, is a better athlete, and is as good or better technically, could still be a Bundesliga quality player in 4 yrs.

Lol, Morales was a starter in Bundesliga last year and is fighting to get back. Bradley hasn't played in Bundesliga in 7 yrs. Jozy hasn't played in Europe in 3 yrs.

To call Roldan or Trapp over Morales is a joke lol.
goalsense
cudevil
Post #185
Monday March 26, 2018 11:54pm

Joined Oct 2012
Total Posts: 994
Original post from bjelks

I would absolutely call Boyd over Dempsey based on the fact that Boyd is playing in a tougher league than Dempsey, is a better athlete, and is as good or better technically, could still be a Bundesliga quality player in 4 yrs.

Lol, Morales was a starter in Bundesliga last year and is fighting to get back. Bradley hasn't played in Bundesliga in 7 yrs. Jozy hasn't played in Europe in 3 yrs.

To call Roldan or Trapp over Morales is a joke lol.


Boyd doesn't deserve a call up at all. If he was called in over Dempsey now, it would only because is being phased out entirely. At no point prior should Boyd have been called in ahead of Dempsey.

Morales was a some time starter last year. But here's the thing-obvious top flight talent tends to get snapped up by another top flight club rather than go down. See e.g., Tim Chandler. The fact that he stayed at Ingolstadt shows he's fringe-y. You don't want Roldan or Trapp? Fine. But Morales has no place in the USMNT set up moving forward. He's not high level talent and he's too old.

bjelks
Post #186
Tuesday March 27, 2018 4:09am

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 1,372
I just don't understand why a minority playing in Europe has to be starting for a Champs League team to be national team quality, but a washed up or mediocre MLS player that was part of US Soccer politics is.
This goes back to MLS bias in US Soccer that has been a detriment to the program.
How does everyone else in the world view MLS as equivalent to 3rd division but us?
European players come to MLS to collect an easy check after their prime and play into their late 30s because the level is a cakewalk for them.
goalsense
cudevil
Post #187
Tuesday March 27, 2018 1:12pm

Joined Oct 2012
Total Posts: 994
Original post from bjelks

I just don't understand why a minority playing in Europe has to be starting for a Champs League team to be national team quality, but a washed up or mediocre MLS player that was part of US Soccer politics is.
This goes back to MLS bias in US Soccer that has been a detriment to the program.
How does everyone else in the world view MLS as equivalent to 3rd division but us?
European players come to MLS to collect an easy check after their prime and play into their late 30s because the level is a cakewalk for them.


You are really trying to cobble together some argument that Boyd should have been called in before Dempsey? Really? If anything, Dempsey is the equivalent of the European player coming back to dominate the MLS.

bjelks
Post #188
Tuesday March 27, 2018 2:35pm

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 1,372
No, I'm trying to figure out how calling in Trapp or Roldan over Morales is justified
goalsense
cudevil
Post #189
Tuesday March 27, 2018 3:29pm

Joined Oct 2012
Total Posts: 994
Original post from bjelks

No, I'm trying to figure out how calling in Trapp or Roldan over Morales is justified


Roldan is 22. Trapp is 25. They each at least have a chance to be in the pool come 2022. Morales will be 28 soon, and has no chance of being on the squad in ‘22

bjelks
Post #190
Tuesday March 27, 2018 3:38pm

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 1,372
Age doesn't matter if you're trash, Roldan nor Trapp are rumored to play in Bundesliga 1 or 2 anytime soon. So why invest in young players with low ceilings? Morales could still be a 1st or 2nd division player in 4 yrs which is higher than Roldan or Trapp have seen.
goalsense
Spank
661
Post #191
Tuesday March 27, 2018 4:34pm

Joined Feb 2013
Total Posts: 132
I'm with bjelks on this one completely. The rose tinted MLS goggles that some of you wear clearly clouds your judgment. I find it outrageous that some of you think MLS Trapp and Roldan have a potentially higher ceiling than someone who played in the Bundesliga but who's team was relegated. I haven't heard any news of those two being snatched up by a 1st division euro team. I'm aware that they are younger and may one day be a Geoff Cameron but that day is not today.

blaise213
Post #192
Tuesday March 27, 2018 6:08pm

Joined Sep 2012
Total Posts: 2,998
Bjelks is always on point!

Anyone see this stupid article on ESPN on what our starting XI would've been had we made the World Cup? What a joke. US would've been bounced out of the group stages. Basically the same XI from the Trinidad game minus Gonzalez.

http://www.espn.com/sports/soccer/story/_/id/...

hamsamwich
Post #193
Tuesday March 27, 2018 8:40pm

Joined Oct 2013
Total Posts: 3,212
The individual merits of players can be argued. But Canouse played 2 bundesliga recently that doesn't make him a call up. Money clouds the reasons people play in certain leagues or others. But Morales in particular had his chance and was average. Unless a guy is playing well in a top league, it's just an argument whether he's "MLS level" or not. Trapp could play in the 2nd bundesliga but not the top league. Fringy is a way to describe over 90% of the player pool. We have a long way to go and blanket statements about leagues doesn't do much.

Know Nothing
Post #194
Tuesday March 27, 2018 9:23pm

Joined Jan 2013
Total Posts: 1,726
We can't extrapolate what someone would do in what situation...there is no way of telling if Trapp could play better than Morales in Bund 2 or if Morales would outshine Trapp in MLS. The simple fact is that in small samplings Trapp has looked better for the Nats than Morales (also debateable). Since we are in the process of identifying talent I would have loved to have seen Kyle Scott there too.

I don't really care where they come from, so long as the 11 that put on the shirt play hard and play as a cohesive unit. This team will be built around Pulisic so this may well be a wasted game anyway since he isn't here to evaluate what players work best with him.

navi8132
New York
Post #195
Tuesday March 27, 2018 11:30pm

Joined Jul 2012
Total Posts: 3,122
Tonight's U.S. MNT Starting XI vs. Paraguay: 12-Zack Steffen; 2-DeAndre Yedlin, 3-Matt Miazga, 5-Cameron Carter-Vickers, 19-Jorge Villafaña; 20-Wil Trapp (capt.); 6-Darlington Nagbe, 8-Marky Delgado, 4-Tyler Adams, 10-Kenny Saief; 7-Bobby Wood

Ok, so I am only interested in seeing: how Saief will do, if Adams can improve upon his last USMNT game, and that's pretty much it. We better see Robinson, Moore, Rubin, and Weah in the second half, otherwise what the hell was the point of this game? To have those players practice in training sessions?

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