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Rey Regicide
Post #211
Wednesday November 16, 2016 4:49pm

Joined Sep 2013
Total Posts: 2,001
Original post from munns5986

I am sure some of this is probably just projecting my personality on others but I keep hearing JK has lost the locker room. This very well could be the case. Not sure how that is an excuse for how the team played though. I had coaches I absolutely didn't like but pride kicked in and played my heart out. There were several players last night that blew my mind. Watching Gonzalez basically walk over to close down a player on the end line set me off. When Jones checks out he gets reckless or completely disappears. I hate calling out a couple of players in a game where nothing went well really but those were the 2 I kept thinking about.


Wasn't the argument that the formations is what caused our players paralysis?

I loved seeing MLS.com say that this is the lineup they should trot out, and that "hopefully" they would see it. Well that lineup was trotted out and we still looked disconnected.

SiteBomb621
Post #212
Wednesday November 16, 2016 5:38pm

Joined Jan 2014
Total Posts: 176
I've said this a hundred times on this site and many other sites. The issue with the USSF is the entitlement issues. In no other sport does a superior player get benched or not selected to a team based on his personality or work rate. The USSF is so stuck on being European instead of being uniquely American that it's actually making us implode. DO NOT get me wrong the younger crop of players are VERY exciting and growth is phenomenal. But when you can put together an XI of snubbed and players that have exceptional skill sets and beat this team you have a BIG PROBLEM. The entire USSF needs to be blown up and started over with new values and sports theory.

Before a USMNT is selected, there should be two teams playing at all times, an A and B squad where the B squad is playing international friendlies and training and then an A v B national televised game so that fans and analyst can see the best 23 at all times. There is no reason right now for Bradley to be playing, or Chandler, or Besler and many others. We are not able to see the best 23 because of biased European thought process holding grudges and hypocrisy holding some players to standards and others not.

snipes87
Cleveland, Ohio
Post #213
Wednesday November 16, 2016 5:46pm

Joined Jul 2013
Total Posts: 893
I agree with Rey on JK. I thought your analogy was great.

I thought at best we come out of these 2 games with 1 point. We have 0. Big deal. We aren't good right now. Someone said it earlier.. unless we find different CMs then it doesn't matter who the manager is.

Chandler has to go. Come on back Yedlin. We need a LB. Preferbbaly Fabian since he was garbage on the wings. He doesn't have Glabach talent around him to make him better out there. Gonzo get out and stay out.

No to Arena. He had a magical WC run followed by the worst WC in years. The magic is out. And don't throw out MLS coaches or people like Bielsa (who I believe is going back to Marsielle when they get their new owners).

Our problems are in the midfield. Terrible protection for our backline. Can't do anything in attack. Can't start and hold possession. I was a Jones guy but these last 2 games showed I think he's done.
If you don't love it, leave it, USA #1
Live490
Texas
Post #214
Wednesday November 16, 2016 5:48pm

Joined Mar 2013
Total Posts: 1,174
Where is dunlopp? Lop he is like JKs son.

MSantoine
Post #215
Wednesday November 16, 2016 5:58pm

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 3,723
Before the hex started, if you looked at the 4 games vs Mexico & CR combined, most would say 4-6 points is the goal (win at home vs CR, win/tie at home vs Mexico, 2 road losses), and 3 points would be acceptable. No one in their right mind would expect 12 points from those 4 games. Yes it sucks they are the first two games of the hex, but they dont change anything. As long as we take care of business vs T&T & Panama (9 points minimum) and win at home vs Honduras we will at least be in the 4th spot. Then a win/tie at home to CR or on the road to Honduras puts us in 3rd. You dont need to win the hex (see Mexico & CR last cycle), you just need to make it to Russia.

BMD15
Boston
Post #216
Wednesday November 16, 2016 6:17pm

Joined Oct 2015
Total Posts: 147
I don't necessarily disagree with the sentiment MSantoine - I think 4-6 points from those 4 games is a reasonable expectation.

Losing 4-0 to a Costa Rica team where we looked inept, disorganized, lackadaisical, and uninterested is the big rub. It certainly looks (from an outsiders perspective) that JK has lost the locker room and that the players have lost faith in him based on what we saw last night. While none of us are privy to the on-goings behind closed doors, if that's true he HAS to go or Russia 2018 is in serious jeopardy.
NETID
kicksNgiggles10
Birmingham
Post #217
Wednesday November 16, 2016 6:43pm

Joined Oct 2012
Total Posts: 572
Original post from SiteBomb621

I've said this a hundred times on this site and many other sites. The issue with the USSF is the entitlement issues. In no other sport does a superior player get benched or not selected to a team based on his personality or work rate. The USSF is so stuck on being European instead of being uniquely American that it's actually making us implode. DO NOT get me wrong the younger crop of players are VERY exciting and growth is phenomenal. But when you can put together an XI of snubbed and players that have exceptional skill sets and beat this team you have a BIG PROBLEM. The entire USSF needs to be blown up and started over with new values and sports theory.

Before a USMNT is selected, there should be two teams playing at all times, an A and B squad where the B squad is playing international friendlies and training and then an A v B national televised game so that fans and analyst can see the best 23 at all times. There is no reason right now for Bradley to be playing, or Chandler, or Besler and many others. We are not able to see the best 23 because of biased European thought process holding grudges and hypocrisy holding some players to standards and others not.

who are these "superior" players?

Rey Regicide
Post #218
Wednesday November 16, 2016 7:12pm

Joined Sep 2013
Total Posts: 2,001
When's our next qualifer?

When's the MLS end/begin again?

How many Euro players will be in form, how many of them broken through?

Oh man, this can get hairy no?

admsghs27
Post #219
Wednesday November 16, 2016 7:14pm

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 6,060
Original post from Live490

Where is dunlopp? Lop he is like JKs son.

He is coming up with some incredible excuse to back him up is gonna take him some time lol. Also cleancutmige hasn't been around also.

SiteBomb621
Post #220
Wednesday November 16, 2016 7:17pm

Joined Jan 2014
Total Posts: 176
Original post from kicksNgiggles10

who are these "superior" players?


If you cannot think outside of the box and name at least 5 snubbed players not on this roster, then what is the point of having this convo? This is exactly my problem with this site. To many know-it-all idiots how literally have two brain cells that are constantly fighting one another lol.... Seriously you can't think of a starting XI with players that sat the bench yesterday and snubbed players that would give any JK team a run for its $$$?

admsghs27
Post #221
Wednesday November 16, 2016 7:18pm

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 6,060
https://mobile.twitter.com/i/web/status/79892...

Nailed it!!! JK indeed worst us soccer coach ever!!!!

TheTruth
Post #222
Wednesday November 16, 2016 7:36pm

Joined Dec 2013
Total Posts: 950
Well, at least this weak start provides the benefit of focus. There is no tomorrow. Who cares about 2018 (that will take care of itself). This is all about 2017. The only thing that matters is qualifying - getting 13+ points. This is about putting the best team on the field for the next 8 games.

Howard & Guzan obviously stay - you'd have to have your head examined if you want those 2 guys to make way.
I said before the CR game that Jones/Bradley were the 2 biggest question marks going forward - I think this is still the case.
As for the others. . . this really isn't about wholesale changes. You can't drop Wood, Altidore, Morris, Pulisic, Fabian, Cameron, Besler, Brooks, Green, Yedlin.

chris_thebassplayer
San Jose
Post #223
Wednesday November 16, 2016 7:39pm

Joined May 2013
Total Posts: 1,518
I agree with others, after the start of the Mexico game, we would have been happy to get out of it with a point...didn't happen but the difference is only one point. I had high hopes we could get out of CR with a tie, but we got the usual beat down. Now we get to stew over it until March.

Some guys had outlier bad performances, but our mentality was fragile. The Cameron injury really hurt us, but there are a number of areas that need to be addressed.

This is a wake up call for JK to finally assess his midfield. The key to our success will be how he reconstructs the midfield. That's the biggest take away for me. He needs to get past the MB/JJ thing and move forward. Hopefully with Cam at Dmid.

Ultimately, we all agree that a USA team that isn't fighting tooth and nail is a deal breaker. That is on JK's ability to motivate his players and also his selection of players. I really don't care what league players are from or what cred they have outside of playing for the nats, if they don't bring it from the start or worse shutdown in the face of adversity, they have no business playing for USA...that is a galling bad look.

I support JK, but if he can't get that right then we need to move on...deal breaker.

Know Nothing
Post #224
Wednesday November 16, 2016 7:47pm

Joined Jan 2013
Total Posts: 1,702
Original post from MSantoine

Before the hex started, if you looked at the 4 games vs Mexico & CR combined, most would say 4-6 points is the goal (win at home vs CR, win/tie at home vs Mexico, 2 road losses), and 3 points would be acceptable. No one in their right mind would expect 12 points from those 4 games. Yes it sucks they are the first two games of the hex, but they dont change anything. As long as we take care of business vs T&T & Panama (9 points minimum) and win at home vs Honduras we will at least be in the 4th spot. Then a win/tie at home to CR or on the road to Honduras puts us in 3rd. You dont need to win the hex (see Mexico & CR last cycle), you just need to make it to Russia.


True, mathematically we are not out of it by a longshot. I think the issue at hand is the heart and desire of this team. This is not a cohesive unit...for the most part it seemed like 11 strangers out there where we struggled to put two passes together and our defense was Swiss Cheese. Something needs to change...especially in the midfield.

Has JK run out of ideas? Hard to say since he is trying new things...but with the same players (for the most part). I don't think they will fire him so he needs to figure out how to shore up the central midfield.

But I don't think it is all on JK. If he knew Gonzo would play that badly I am sure he would have gone with someone else. I think cap tying CCV would have been an improvement over Gonzo last night and would have been one silver lining we can hang our hat on.

I understand putting Zusi on..he always plays with heart. But why not turn to Gooch instead who is younger, could use the experience, and has just as much heart and maybe a little more skill?

Live490
Texas
Post #225
Wednesday November 16, 2016 8:02pm

Joined Mar 2013
Total Posts: 1,174
Fabjo has to be an outside back. And if it was up to me, he would not get called in. If ppl request Bradley out, fabjo has looked just as bad. And he is not even solid defending but since JK doesnt want to call real LBs, he is better than his experiments. Jones, thank you for your service. OG, bye. Chsnfler you suck. Zusi, bye. Befoya, bye. Get in Lletget. Roldan. They might not be the best, but i can assure those two would have played with more heart than some did. Get players that feel the team. The nation's colors. Zardes and his brick one touch would have kept hustling. Deuce. I miss you. LD, come back, even if it is as a bench role. We will turn this around, but i really want JK gone now.

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