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Rey Regicide
Post #16
Wednesday January 6, 2016 5:47pm

Joined Sep 2013
Total Posts: 2,001
Man U were all about academy and then matriculation, then they weren't

Same with Arsenal

Same with Barcelona

however certain academies produce players that eventually go onto becoming professionals

lol in Chelsea's case.. West Ham like gave them a starting 11

Lampard
Terry
Jcole
G Johnson

etc, holy smokes this is incredible

Know Nothing
Post #17
Wednesday January 6, 2016 7:55pm

Joined Jan 2013
Total Posts: 1,361
Original post from Rey Regicide

Man U were all about academy and then matriculation, then they weren't

Same with Arsenal

Same with Barcelona

however certain academies produce players that eventually go onto becoming professionals

lol in Chelsea's case.. West Ham like gave them a starting 11

Lampard
Terry
Jcole
G Johnson

etc, holy smokes this is incredible


It's all relative. The Chelsea academy has produced professional players...just not professionals of the caliber required by Chelsea. As @MSantoine said, it is not an indictment of the quality of the player, it is just the situation. I dare say Kyle Scott will be a good professional player, it's just that Chelsea have so many good young players (but older than Scott) at his position that he would have to be exceptional to stand out. But still, being in that kind of environment is helpful to player development.

Kudos to West Ham and Southampton for that matter in their ability to develop technically gifted players.

Rey Regicide
Post #18
Thursday January 7, 2016 2:04pm

Joined Sep 2013
Total Posts: 2,001
Very good point Mr. Nothing, but just wondering, how many of Chelsea's academy go onto being professionals?

Also good point on Southampton, they are the envy of the whole league.

Mojofc
Post #19
Thursday January 7, 2016 2:34pm

Joined Jan 2013
Total Posts: 966
MUFC academy players..

Darron Gibson
Adnan Januzaj
John OShea
Tom Cleverly
Ryan Shawcross
Johnny Evans
Phil Bardsley
Kieran Richardson
Ben Foster
Danny Welbeck
Wes Brown
Johnathan Spector
Frazier Campbell
Paul Pogba
Paddy McNair
Tyler Blackett
Ritchie DeLaet
Danny Drinkwater

They're producing plenty of talent. Their players are littered across the first division.
Rain, rain, go away Come again another day - USMNT, MUFC
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West Palm Beach
Post #20
Thursday January 7, 2016 3:37pm

Joined Jul 2013
Total Posts: 1,322
Arsenal Products:
Keiran Gibbs (first team Arsenal)
Jack Wilshere (First team Arsenal)
Francis Coquelin (First team Arsenal)
Hector Bellerin (first team arsenal)
Alex Iwobi (Breaking into Arsenal first team)
Wojciech Szczesny (AS Roma starting GK)
Emmanuel Frimpong
Nicklas Bendtner
Ashley Cole
Armand Traore
Sebastian Larsson
Johan Djourou
Ainsley Maitland-Niles
Daniel Crowley
Chuba Akpom
Serge Gnabry
www.westpalmbeachchurchofchrist.com
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Post #21
Thursday January 7, 2016 4:23pm

Joined Feb 2013
Total Posts: 119
LOL @ Johnathan Spector from Man United's academy.

TheTruth
Post #22
Thursday January 7, 2016 5:01pm

Joined Dec 2013
Total Posts: 950
Yeah, I've always been a Spector fan, but good one. And don't forget about Jovan Kirovsky.

Know Nothing
Post #23
Thursday January 7, 2016 5:25pm

Joined Jan 2013
Total Posts: 1,361
Original post from Rey Regicide

Very good point Mr. Nothing, but just wondering, how many of Chelsea's academy go onto being professionals?

Also good point on Southampton, they are the envy of the whole league.


Because they cast a wide net and recruit worldwide, it is difficult to keep track of a lot of them. Off the top of my head and a quick web search...

No Longer With CFC
Jeffrey Brouma
Miroslav Stoch
Michael Mancienne
Scott Sinclair
Gokhan Tore
Fabio Borini
Milan Lalkovic
Gael Kakuta
Josh McEachern
Rohan Ince
Ben Gordon
Sam Hutchinson

On the Bench
Ruben Loftus Cheek

On Loan (of note)
Nathaniel Chalobah (Napoli)
Nathan Ake (Watford)
Dominic Solanke (Vitesse)
Isaah Brown (Vitesse)
Lewis Baker (Vitesse)
Andreas Christensen (Borussia Mochengladbach)
Jeremie Boga (Rennes)

I will point out that since Chelsea has not had the long term success as Arse, Pool, or MU, they have not attracted the top talent until recently. I have only listed the players on loan in the top Euro leagues that were produced in the academy.

MSantoine
Post #24
Thursday January 7, 2016 5:57pm

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 3,723
I dont think you can easily quantify and compare the academies. The are tons of writers who published top 10/top 20 lists but its mostly based off of past reputation and not really hard data. Also what is more impressive ifor an academy? Produce the occasional start, lots of flameouts. Consistently produce career professionals, no real stars, produce high end talent, no real stars, some flameouts.

Think academies like Boca Juniors, Corinthians, Santos. They produce some mega stars by virtue of being in Argentina/Brazil. But they also produce tons of youth players who never leave South America, and probably never get more than a handful of caps. Is that better than an academy like Barca where you're pretty much guarenteed a 8-10 year professional soccer career if you're on their U19 squad barring injury.

Rey Regicide
Post #25
Thursday January 7, 2016 7:26pm

Joined Sep 2013
Total Posts: 2,001
money right? I mean that's what the academies are for, to take investment into a product put it to use in your factory at a low cost, or sell it at the highest bid

MSantoine
Post #26
Thursday January 7, 2016 8:28pm

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 3,723
Original post from Rey Regicide

money right? I mean that's what the academies are for, to take investment into a product put it to use in your factory at a low cost, or sell it at the highest bid


That is one train of thought. Thats the Chelsea model and to an extent the Southampton model.

Another model is develop players that can be the 8-11 players in your lineup so you can spend more money on your top end starters and still have a good squad, kind of like Juventus and Bayern Munich.

Know Nothing
Post #27
Thursday January 7, 2016 8:54pm

Joined Jan 2013
Total Posts: 1,361
Original post from MSantoine

That is one train of thought. Thats the Chelsea model and to an extent the Southampton model.

Another model is develop players that can be the 8-11 players in your lineup so you can spend more money on your top end starters and still have a good squad, kind of like Juventus and Bayern Munich.


Pretty much, except I think when they changed to hire Pep they got away from that philosophy.

If Chelsea had known they would sink this far this fast I dare say they would have kept Ake and maybe Solanke. On current form Ake would be the starting LB.

dolcem
Post #28
Thursday January 7, 2016 10:43pm

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 1,786
Original post from Know Nothing

I will point out that since Chelsea has not had the long term success as Arse, Pool, or MU, they have not attracted the top talent until recently. I have only listed the players on loan in the top Euro leagues that were produced in the academy.


Chelsea has dominated England for nearly fifteen years-the kids in their academy now were toddlers when Mourinho joined them. It's no excuse. They snatch some of the top youth prodigies from other academies and they still can't develop them into quality professionals. They just don't have enough incentive to do so because all they care about is short term results (Abramovic).
GET A CLUB TEAM
Know Nothing
Post #29
Friday January 8, 2016 12:53am

Joined Jan 2013
Total Posts: 1,361
Original post from dolcem

Chelsea has dominated England for nearly fifteen years-the kids in their academy now were toddlers when Mourinho joined them. It's no excuse. They snatch some of the top youth prodigies from other academies and they still can't develop them into quality professionals. They just don't have enough incentive to do so because all they care about is short term results (Abramovic).


Before I comment further I would like your definition of what a quality professional is?

Rey Regicide
Post #30
Friday January 8, 2016 1:36pm

Joined Sep 2013
Total Posts: 2,001
Original post from MSantoine

That is one train of thought. Thats the Chelsea model and to an extent the Southampton model.

Another model is develop players that can be the 8-11 players in your lineup so you can spend more money on your top end starters and still have a good squad, kind of like Juventus and Bayern Munich.


That's what I meant by putting your investment back into your factory, instead of going out and buying all the parts, you built them yourself and low end cost. In theory, when it becomes too expense to hold onto, you sell them.

So it really all comes down to how much they're worth, no?

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