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USAGunner
West Palm Beach
Post #46
Wednesday August 12, 2015 4:06pm

Joined Jul 2013
Total Posts: 1,322
Original post from USnLFCfan

They, as a whole, are more technically sound players though.


Come on dude. Be real. You asked for them, I gave you them, no you have another excuse.

Sure for some of them that might be the case. But that's just not near as much as you might like to think. And many of those countries are not known for being technically sound...far from it.
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USnLFCfan
Savannah GA
Post #47
Wednesday August 12, 2015 4:17pm

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 1,410
Original post from USAGunner

Come on dude. Be real. You asked for them, I gave you them, no you have another excuse.

Sure for some of them that might be the case. But that's just not near as much as you might like to think. And many of those countries are not known for being technically sound...far from it.


Of the ones you named only Austrialia, Cameroon, and Senegal would be the only ones you could debate about not being know for being technically sound. It's also debatable whether we are better than any of those, outside of Australia. It's not an excuse, it's just a fact that most US fans don't want to believe.....we are still behind the majority of countries when it comes to technical ability. Also I gave you the reason, the work permit kills the US player pool. You can't tell me that their is a bias when there are scouts all over the US at club tournaments actively looking for talent.

USAGunner
West Palm Beach
Post #48
Wednesday August 12, 2015 4:53pm

Joined Jul 2013
Total Posts: 1,322
Original post from USnLFCfan

Of the ones you named only Austrialia, Cameroon, and Senegal would be the only ones you could debate about not being know for being technically sound. It's also debatable whether we are better than any of those, outside of Australia. It's not an excuse, it's just a fact that most US fans don't want to believe.....we are still behind the majority of countries when it comes to technical ability. Also I gave you the reason, the work permit kills the US player pool. You can't tell me that their is a bias when there are scouts all over the US at club tournaments actively looking for talent.


So you are saying for those 4 leagues that it's easier to get a work permit if you are in places like Venezuela, South Korea, Japan, etc?
Specifically for the EPL it's not any more difficult for the USA than it is for ANY other non European nation.
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Dave
Post #49
Wednesday August 12, 2015 5:27pm

Joined Jul 2014
Total Posts: 1,003
Original post from USAGunner

No where near the talent is just hyperbole.
However these countries have more (or just as many guys) as the USA in the big 4 leagues. (this does not include B teams and Reserves)

USA - 12

Senegal 21
Australia 11
South Korea 9
Algeria 14
Japan 16
Cameroon 10
Venezuela 12

The USA number gets a LOT smaller when you take out the guys who grew up in the country they play in (mostly Germany) and GK. It actually goes to just 1 I believe (Geoff Cameroon).


Many of the nations in Africa have "Colonial" ties to nations in Europe. The players from these nations can often obtain a work permit through family ties (Grandparents etc...). Australia is a similar situation. These ties make it easier for them to obtain work permits in order to play in the EPL.

USnLFCfan
Savannah GA
Post #50
Wednesday August 12, 2015 5:43pm

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 1,410
Original post from Dave

Many of the nations in Africa have "Colonial" ties to nations in Europe. The players from these nations can often obtain a work permit through family ties (Grandparents etc...). Australia is a similar situation. These ties make it easier for them to obtain work permits in order to play in the EPL.


Exactly. The same goes for SA, many are tied to Italian and Portuguese. 60% of Argentina claim Italian descent.

USAGunner
West Palm Beach
Post #51
Wednesday August 12, 2015 6:01pm

Joined Jul 2013
Total Posts: 1,322
Argentina is irrelevant. They are much better than us. Lol.
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USnLFCfan
Savannah GA
Post #52
Wednesday August 12, 2015 6:09pm

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 1,410
Just pointing out there is a large of amount of SA countries that have European ancestry that they can use to get work permits. A big part of it is the immigration of Europeans to SA after WW2.

USAGunner
West Palm Beach
Post #53
Wednesday August 12, 2015 6:18pm

Joined Jul 2013
Total Posts: 1,322
So you want me to go through and of those countries see which of those players actually have dual citizenship? You want to bet that the USA actually falls lower down the totem pole when we look at non-dual nationals and just pure Americans?

I'm game. Check back at the end of the day...
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USnLFCfan
Savannah GA
Post #54
Wednesday August 12, 2015 6:52pm

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 1,410
Whatever floats your boat, if you can't accept the fact that there are plenty of countries outside the top 10 that are still ahead of the US technically, I don't know what to tell you.If there was bias, European clubs wouldn't spend so much money scouting here, and you would have to ignore the large amount of kids signing for European clubs and there are more and more every year. Should put down the tinfoil headgear.

admsghs27
Post #55
Wednesday August 12, 2015 7:28pm

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 6,060
Original post from USnLFCfan

Just pointing out there is a large of amount of SA countries that have European ancestry that they can use to get work permits. A big part of it is the immigration of Europeans to SA after WW2.

Ohh yeah and i'm guessing the Majority of Caucasian Americans also have European Ancestry.. That has nothing to do with it Euro clubs would rather take a South American or African over an American player, even if the American player is a bit better. They are just Biased to Americans. Just look at all the players we have playing in the Big "4" Leagues most well almost all of them are Dual nationals and started in Europe since they were kids. The only ones that actually got interest and were brought over are Cameron, and Yedlin, and Yedlin isn't playing yet and Cameron will most likely lose his spot once that guy comes back. So that will leave Zero players that have gone to Europe and actually played consistently in the past couple years.

USnLFCfan
Savannah GA
Post #56
Wednesday August 12, 2015 7:55pm

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 1,410
So you are just going to ignore the amount of money spent scouting and setting up club affiliations here by European clubs, they are biased and actually don't want to buy Americans but yet waste money of here? Lol. Ok. That tinfoil hat game is strong.

USAGunner
West Palm Beach
Post #57
Wednesday August 12, 2015 8:17pm

Joined Jul 2013
Total Posts: 1,322
Original post from USnLFCfan

So you are just going to ignore the amount of money spent scouting and setting up club affiliations here by European clubs, they are biased and actually don't want to buy Americans but yet waste money of here? Lol. Ok. That tinfoil hat game is strong.


Ignore the trolls.

I have never said that they don't want to buy americans, or that they completely ignore america. Gotta read and separate what some are saying and what others are saying. Also didn't say there wasn't a technical difference between the US players and some other countries.

All I have said is that if there is a US player and a Euro player that are equal or the US player isn't noticeably better (even if slightly better) that they will pick the Euro player. So the US players do have a disadvantage and there is a bias there. Does it go as far as some here are supposing? nope. They will play a US player if he is much better than others on their team. So it's not that they won't play them, but they definitely are working from a disadvantage. Not all non-Euro countries have that disadvantage, many don't at all. Heck some South American countries have an advantage (They are given every chance because they are Brazilian or Argentian,etc).

To deny that is no better than to say what adms is saying.

Taking away the dual nationals, those that have passports (at time of transfer) to both countries, or those who moved there at a young age for youth academies (pre-16 years old) here is how it works out for the countries listed before.

Japan 12
Senegal 9
Australia 6
South Korea 6
Venezuela 6
Costa Rica 6
Ecuador 4
USA 4 (Guzan, Howard, Yedlin, Cameron)
Algeria 2
Cameroon 2

Cameroon and Algeria have a lot of French born players. Makes it easy for them to get work permit to other EU countries.
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admsghs27
Post #58
Wednesday August 12, 2015 8:20pm

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 6,060
I think as of late we have been doing a pretty good job at Developing players.. I see America as a top 10 development soccer country in the world within the next 5-10 years. I mean it shows in International tournaments and friendlies with our youth teams Sub 20 all the way to Sub 14/15 they have looked really good against the best clubs and countries around the world. So that tells me kids here are starting to get the right training and knowledge. Also we have have the most youth ages 6-18 playing soccer now than ever before i believe is over football to. The problem now is the Money many parents can't afford to drive their kids for Hours every weekend for tournaments or enroll them into an Academy.

admsghs27
Post #59
Wednesday August 12, 2015 8:25pm

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 6,060
Original post from USAGunner

Japan 12
Senegal 9
Australia 6
South Korea 6
Venezuela 6
Costa Rica 6
Ecuador 4
USA 4 (Guzan, Howard, Yedlin, Cameron)
Algeria 2
Cameroon 2

Cameroon and Algeria have a lot of French born players. Makes it easy for them to get work permit to other EU countries.


Yet we are arguably better than all those countries at soccer. Btw only 2 field players for USA and only 1 is playing and is not even in the MNT picture as of late.
I have been saying USA right now is easily a top 15-20 team in the World with an all Domestic Team. Yes i think MLS is that good and we have really good players here.

TheTruth
Post #60
Wednesday August 12, 2015 8:43pm

Joined Dec 2013
Total Posts: 950
Well, just because no one else brought it up. . .

Look at all of the countries on this list. Right, these are A. All shittier countries to live in than the US (yes, this is an opinion); B. Domestic leagues are all worse than the US, ie, less $$ (maybe an exception like Ecuador here??).

Anyway, the point is to look at the other side: the "push" factors are much stronger for players to get the hell outta those countries vs. the US. So to conclude that the players from those countries are "better" than the US is a stretch.

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