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USAGunner
West Palm Beach
Post #136
Thursday March 26, 2015 8:41pm

Joined Jul 2013
Total Posts: 1,304
Not sure what you are looking for in terms of an identity.

Had a CLEAR identity for the World Cup. It was thrown out of wack when Altidore went down. But even after that the team had an identity.

I suppose you want the same identity year in and year out, never changing? Sorry the USA won't have that until our youth system and MLS is more established.

We as a Country don't have a Soccer identity. If we do have one I suppose you can say strong GK. Which in that case...we still have that. So perhaps thats an identity you are looking for?

In terms of how we play, ours will always be an identity that is changing from Tournament to Tournament. USA doesn't have a Soccer Culture identity (like a Brazil, etc) our players come from all over and play all over. Thus making our identity even more mis-mashed.

Personally with our personnel one thing that we are is diverse and very adaptive. Some may not like it, but that is certainly part of our identity (being able to change how we play based on our opponent...something we certainly did in the World Cup). After all some of the most successful sports organizations...that is their identity (NE Patriots for one)). I like it that way, keeps our opponents off keel a little bit about what we are going to do, makes it harder to prepare for us. Since we don't have a Messi/Ronaldo type player that can take over a game, that actually works out well.
www.westpalmbeachchurchofchrist.com
skangles
DC
Post #137
Thursday March 26, 2015 8:56pm

Joined Jan 2013
Total Posts: 5,150
Original post from USAGunner

JK does not care about W/L in Friendlies (except warm up friendlies for big tournaments...such as the 3 matches before the World Cup).

Here is his record in non-Friendly matches (including the warm-up friendlies):
22-3-5 (an average of 2.3 points a match (3 for win, 1 for draw))

In Friendlies he is:
11-8-11 (an average of 1.4 points a match)

While at Germany:
Non-Friendlies he was 9-1-2 (2.3 points a match)
Friendlies he was 11-6-4 (1.9 points a match).

He tinkers in Friendlies, and sees what people have in different positions. But when it comes to competitive matches, he knows what he has and what kind of positions he can put people in and knows peoples best positions (not just what people think is), because they have been there before. He'll tinker against Switzerland, he'll tinker against Mexico in April (probably less than normal), He'll tinker in the June camp against Netherlands and Germany (although he'll be coming around to a firm roster at this point in preparation for July's Gold Cup).

But once July hits and they start that camp (and I'm sure we'll have 2 friendlies announced for those matches too) it'll be all business. He'll call in 30, and keep the best 23. It'll be the lineup that he likes best. In the Warm-up Friendlies he'll have probably 7-8 of the 11 firm and he'll see which guys perform in the warm-ups. The team will look much better than it has (and will look progressively better in each warm-up game). He'll settle on those final 2-3 positions and we'll be off to the races.

We'll put in a good performance, win our group and advance to the final.

Stop worrying so much about the team results of the Friendlies. He treats them a lot more like NFL treats preseason games than most. Those games are about getting better and seeing what guys can do.

Newsflash.
Bradley, Altidore, Dempsey, and probably now Brooks are the core of this team. They know what each other can do and have been playing with each other for 5-6 years now. Bradley can play back and he can play forward, he has the tactical awareness to do so, Dempsey can play up top as a secondary striker, he can play as more of cam or he can play outwide. Altidore can play alone up top or he can play with another striker. Now the job this camp, next month and in June and the start of the Gold Cup camp is to see who works best with those guys and in what formation.

Stuff like Morales playing well with Bradley. Stuff like that matters. AJ and Altidore forming a good combo up top. That matters. These are things JK is looking at not the final result or the overall play. But how these guys pair up together in different formations.


Excellent post, can we sticky this?

Know Nothing
Post #138
Thursday March 26, 2015 8:58pm

Joined Jan 2013
Total Posts: 1,062
I agree 100% with Gunner. Until we are more established we will always be a reactive team...our roster and playing style will be dictated by our opponent.

EKneezy
Atlanta
Post #139
Thursday March 26, 2015 11:13pm

Joined May 2013
Total Posts: 2,886
See there Gunner goes being all rational and junk. Why can't I wish to see the world burn??

EKneezy
Atlanta
Post #140
Thursday March 26, 2015 11:16pm

Joined May 2013
Total Posts: 2,886
Original post from navi8132

Come on. Real question is did you love or hate those jerseys?


Meh for now but they might grow on me like the WC away kits.

mmee
Culver City, CA
Post #141
Friday March 27, 2015 10:08am

Joined Mar 2014
Total Posts: 1,850
JK using friendlies as opportunities to tinker is fine.

Crap defending is not fine. Over-tinkering is not fine.

Original post from 2tone

Tell me what MLS prospect looks better than Julian Green?

How many Gedion Zelalems are being produced in MLS?


Good post except for these 2 points above.

1) There could possibly be an MLS prospect better than Green. He's not blowing up, exactly, right now.

2) Zelalem is a top prospect for a top 20 club in the world. It's not an interesting question to wonder where MLS' A+ prospects are, given the state of MLS player development.

USAGunner
West Palm Beach
Post #142
Friday March 27, 2015 1:40pm

Joined Jul 2013
Total Posts: 1,304
mmee...

But given our results in competitive games (pretty dang good). Where is the proof that JK is over-tinkering?

Is it because some fans don't like his tinkering at all? Or they don't like him trying stuff like Shea at LB, Beasley at LB, etc?

Newsflash JK did an excellent job with those 2 moves. One he did those 2 moves before Club teams even thought about it...guess what both of those guys are playing LB for club teams now. Our choices at LB are VERY thin and neither of them were very much in the picture at LW/LM.

You can get mad at him all you want about Jermaine Jones move to CB. But given the amount of CM's we have (plenty), his age, and the amount of proven defenders (not many) why would he not see if Jermaine Jones (an extremely versatile player) can play there.

His tinkering found us a LB for the World Cup (who performed well), found us the ability to put Yedlin at RW as a sub in the World Cup, and sprung some life into the USA attack. Made it easier for us to change up our attack when Jozy and AJ went down in the World Cup (for our "lack of depth" not many teams can lose their top 2 strikers and still advance...except for the Worlds ELITE teams). I can assure you having to play Dempsey alone at top was NEVER in the original plans. That fact we were still able to put together some sort of attack, amazing quite simply.

Another thing people keep saying which is very annoying is the stuff about JK promised us attacking football, etc.

Are you that dense? Do you really want a coach who is going to force players (that we ALL know aren't suited for what he "promised" us) to play that kind of game? Our results would have been Terrible. Sure we may have score a goal or 2 more in the 4 games, but we would have given up about 5-6 more than we did. Only way we wouldn't have is if Tim Howard had a Belgium type game (EVERY GAME). We tried to be more attack minded against Belgium, our defenders just aren't good enough against the worlds best strikers to be able to play that, nor are our midfielders proficient enough in that style to do it successfully. As much as I want us to be that attacking/passing style team (like Arsenal) and play the beautiful game, I'm VERY happy that JK didn't try to the entire tournament. We would have been slaughtered.

Ronaldo would have had a hat-trick on a bum hammy had we tried against them.

Sorry guys like it or not but we don't have the players to play that style yet...We just don't. We all know it. So instead of getting mad at JK for not playing the way he desperately wants, you should be happy that when it comes to competitive matches and tournaments that he plays the way that best gives us the chance to win...
www.westpalmbeachchurchofchrist.com
dolcem
Post #143
Friday March 27, 2015 7:17pm

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 1,692
Original post from mmee

JK using friendlies as opportunities to tinker is fine.

Crap defending is not fine. Over-tinkering is not fine.

Good post except for these 2 points above.

1) There could possibly be an MLS prospect better than Green. He's not blowing up, exactly, right now.

2) Zelalem is a top prospect for a top 20 club in the world. It's not an interesting question to wonder where MLS' A+ prospects are, given the state of MLS player development.


The over-tinkering argument doesn't hold weight. I read a study showing World Cup winners and the amount of different lineups and players they used...they tinker a lot, and more than Klinsmann did last cycle (it was a goal.com article written in answer to the "overtinkering" charge, though I haven't been able to find it). Look at any top national side and they are constantly experimenting, especially in friendlies. And considering that Klinsmann played in three Euros and three World Cups and coached in two of them, I'd say he might know a thing about these kind of decisions.

Which MLS product was ever able to get minutes at a top European club? Landon Donovan was the only one in history, and even then he was more of a German youth academy product than anything else. Green already accomplished that feat in his teens, I'd say his ceiling is pretty damn high, even if he hasn't been able to break in at Hamburg. How many teen players do we have in our pool that could? And let's not forget these MLS prospects play for teams that have absolutely no incentive or know how when it comes to player development. Green may well could turn out to be a bust but he is our brightest prospect apart from Zelalem, who not only plays for a top 20 club but, more importantly, plays for (arguably) the best club in the world when it comes to player development.
GET A CLUB TEAM
skangles
DC
Post #144
Friday March 27, 2015 7:47pm

Joined Jan 2013
Total Posts: 5,150
Gooch would have played for a Top European side had injuries not gotten the best of him. Gooch in 09 was a beast, AC Milan wanted him for a reason.

USAGunner
West Palm Beach
Post #145
Friday March 27, 2015 8:45pm

Joined Jul 2013
Total Posts: 1,304
dolcem,

As much as I'd like to wish Arsenal was #1 Academy. I don't think there is any argument that Barcelona is #1 in the world.

I'd probably put Arsenal in the top 5, perhaps 1-Barcelona, 2-Ajax, 3-Arsenal, 4-Santos, 5-ManUre
www.westpalmbeachchurchofchrist.com
rainORshine
Post #146
Friday March 27, 2015 9:06pm

Joined Dec 2012
Total Posts: 2,097
hope i am not the only one that actually heard JK screaming "YES, YES..." urging his midfield - and MB in particular - to press Denmark deep into their defensive third directly before Denmark breaks the pressure, carries ball through completely vacated center of the park, sends the back four scrambling to cover... eventually leaving bendtner in acres of space at the edge of the 6 to finish for an easy equalizer

JK apparently missed tactics 101 class, where you learn to stay compact and organized when you are up a goal with less than 10 minutes to play

its juvenile tactical awareness. i would expect better at a u12 game

if you are assigning primary responsibility to one player on that goal it has to go to MB - he had completely vacated his defensive area - leaving morales to try to cover about 35 square yards. when that predictably fails the back 4 is left to emergency defending... that predictably fails

credit MB for trying to fulfill JKs wishes i suppose, buts it unbelievably poor judgment coming from sidelines

and its happening with stunning regularity
- columbia - 2 goals / loss
- ireland - 4 / loss
- chile - 3 / loss
- denmark - 3 / loss

JK apologizers: proceed to apologize

2tone
Ten-Towns
Post #147
Friday March 27, 2015 9:35pm

Joined Jul 2012
Total Posts: 9,116
I will say that Jordan Morris and a few other MLS/US based U-23 players do look like top prospects. Just need for these guys to start bursting into the USMNT.

dfw_fan
DfW
Post #148
Friday March 27, 2015 9:47pm

Joined Apr 2013
Total Posts: 855
JK is clueless, he gave Jordan Morris a chance. I am shocked

andylui8
Post #149
Friday March 27, 2015 10:49pm

Joined Jan 2014
Total Posts: 467
Original post from dfw_fan

JK is clueless, he gave Jordan Morris a chance. I am shocked
Jordan messi is good! Watch what you say

admsghs27
Post #150
Friday March 27, 2015 11:16pm

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 5,980
Original post from andylui8

Jordan messi is good! Watch what you say


Hahaha Relax with the Jordan Messi insult. Messi At his age was already being Nominated for World Player of the Year. Not even close at all and no comparison at all. Jordan Morris will never be 1% as good as Messi.

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