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Know Nothing
Post #106
Thursday May 21, 2015 11:45pm

Joined Jan 2013
Total Posts: 1,699
Original post from rainORshine

so do people agree or disagree that benny and sacha are best 'CAM's in pool and deserve to be a part of USMNT?

if not, who is better and based on what evidence? specifically, what have they done at club level in last year that makes you feel they are better?

this question is to everyone


I like Benny's game...he moves the ball quickly and is decisive. I still prefer Mix over Sacha. Mix has a more creative/unpredictable side to his game while Sacha to me seems, for the lack of a better word, robotic.

rainORshine
Post #107
Friday May 22, 2015 12:21am

Joined Dec 2012
Total Posts: 2,097
Original post from Know Nothing

I like Benny's game...he moves the ball quickly and is decisive. I still prefer Mix over Sacha. Mix has a more creative/unpredictable side to his game while Sacha to me seems, for the lack of a better word, robotic.


i would have to agree that sacha sometimes comes off very 'utilitarian' for an attacking player... meaning he is more direct, both offensively and defensively than one would expect for a guy playing a 'skilled' position

but this also may be one of his bigger attributes, because it translates to him being extremely involved in the game over 90 minutes - rarely fading from view for long stretches. you will have a hard time finding another attacking CM who puts in the defensive work he does or a guy who demands/seeks the ball as much.

i think all of this is factor of a couple of things
a) coming of age under the guidance of B. Bradley at Chivas - an extremely pragmatic, "utilitarian" coach. now at NYRB jesse march is a direct product of BB, who was a player who epitomized BBs philosophy

b) lack of respect from US fans and from JK. again, there is no real discussion about the 2 best attacking CMs of this generation - benny and sacha... yet sacha does not get that recognition. he plays with that chip on his shoulder, constantly trying to prove himself.

ultimately sacha does 2 things - produces offense and helps his team win games. mix does neither (Rosenborg back on top of norway now that mix is gone... did not win league when he was there)

camparkinson
Post #108
Friday May 22, 2015 1:01am

Joined Aug 2012
Total Posts: 334
For me Sacha just never did enough when with USA. To slow to be a real box to box #8 and not good enough on attack to be #10 or support forward. But I admit he is playing well with NYRB but I'd rather see a younger player get a look as I feel like I know Sacha's limitations... I'd rather someone like Rowe get a shot.

I certainly think Benny deserves a chance though, one of the best MIDs in MLS right now and has been for a year or so.

MIX has been awful for NYCFC and theoretically call ups are decided based on club form then he should be no where near this next roster. But we know Klinsmann just likes to say that not really do it and we also know he rates MIX highly and on top of that MIX has played very well in his last few Nats appearances, I really liked MIX as a tucked in outside mid in the 442 diamond.

rainORshine
Post #109
Saturday May 23, 2015 1:22am

Joined Dec 2012
Total Posts: 2,097
for those terrified of numbers and analytics DONT READ THIS

some timely info posted on an MLS article today... listed the top 10 in MLS in touches this season and added number of passes and number of ball recoveries for these 10 players. basically reiterates the above point

sacha with most touches per 90 among all attacking players at 78 per 90. among attacking players pedro morales #2 at 73 per 90 and Kaka 3rd at 69...
SK # 5 overall in league per 90.

SK #3 in league among all players with 58 passes per 90 - behind only dax and juninho

SK with 7.6 ball recoveries per 90. not surprisingly kaka is the lowest among these players at 4 per 90, but SK also better than morales and surprisingly, kyle beckerman who checks in with only 6 recoveries per 90. (beckerman is past prime and should not return to action for US)

a lot do to marsch's system in NY, basically the kind of high tempo possession soccer that JK has failed to deliver with MNT. maybe marsch for US job?

but also credit to SKs desire to get on the ball and connect passes as well as win it back

would all mean nothing if NYRB sucked but the fact that RB has been an elite team so far and played above expectations gives it weight

rainORshine
Post #110
Thursday July 2, 2015 9:02pm

Joined Dec 2012
Total Posts: 2,097
time to stir this pot again

NYRB - 3
NYCFC - 1

sacha with 2 assists

sacha would have scored TWO goals v germany!

Know Nothing
Post #111
Thursday July 2, 2015 9:06pm

Joined Jan 2013
Total Posts: 1,699
...logs in to Yanks-abroad, sees the Sasha v Mix thread, wonders if @rainorshine has the same manic look Jack Nicholson has during "The Shining" when he types responses...sips coffee..shakes head

stone88
Post #112
Thursday July 2, 2015 11:33pm

Joined Aug 2012
Total Posts: 1,517
Original post from rainORshine

time to stir this pot again

NYRB - 3
NYCFC - 1

sacha with 2 assists

sacha would have scored TWO goals v germany!




mmee
Culver City, CA
Post #113
Friday July 3, 2015 12:37am

Joined Mar 2014
Total Posts: 2,147
The first goal vs Germany, from MB to MD....

Yeah, um, Kljestan would never, ever have thought to make that play- neither the pass nor the run. He's still pretty sure that they broke a rule of some sort- two-line pass or ineligible receiver or something.

rainORshine
Post #114
Friday July 3, 2015 1:12am

Joined Dec 2012
Total Posts: 2,097
Original post from mmee

The first goal vs Germany, from MB to MD....

Yeah, um, Kljestan would never, ever have thought to make that play- neither the pass nor the run. He's still pretty sure that they broke a rule of some sort- two-line pass or ineligible receiver or something.


both guys were on the same field on sunday

- one was dominant and constantly influential; one was generally a bystander
- one helped his team win, including 2 assists; one was predictably on the losing side

mix has one of the great scorers of this generation in front of him and has recorded ONE assist in first 4 months... and his team has been massively disappointing. exactly what you would expect if you were going off prior career production

when mix scores a goal in a world cup, ill be impressed. i wont hold my breath

munns5986
Post #115
Friday July 3, 2015 3:02am

Joined Oct 2012
Total Posts: 272
I remember the game different than you. Even the announcer said Sacha was not good except the 2 assists. Not discounting the assist like you usually do. They were very nice. At some point you are going to have to admit mix is better at the international level than Sacha is. The main article on espnfc even talks about how klose and podolski are better internationally than for club. Pretty sure we would have definitely liked to have had those players at one point.

cudevil
Post #116
Friday July 3, 2015 5:28am

Joined Oct 2012
Total Posts: 989
Original post from rainORshine

both guys were on the same field on sunday

- one was dominant and constantly influential; one was generally a bystander
- one helped his team win, including 2 assists; one was predictably on the losing side

mix has one of the great scorers of this generation in front of him and has recorded ONE assist in first 4 months... and his team has been massively disappointing. exactly what you would expect if you were going off prior career production

when mix scores a goal in a world cup, ill be impressed. i wont hold my breath


You are flat out lying. If Mix scored in the Worod Cup, you'd come up with some other stupid excuse as to why we shouldn't believe what we've seen.

dolcem
Post #117
Friday July 3, 2015 6:22am

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 1,805
Why is this thread still going?

Mix is young and has played well for the NT on a number of occasions, and is a creative attacking midfielder, something of which we're in short supply. Our manager, who usually gets these calls right, likes him. Kljestan, on the other hand, has gotten plenty of looks and never played well for the NT aside from one game or two. His club resume is decent, no better than Mix's, and neither Coach Bob nor Klinsmann rated him highly. Kljestan also has had a very shaky season so far apart from a couple good games, especially during the Red Bull's recent seven game winless streak. He's a slow box-to-box mid, and there aren't really any of those at the highest level.

No one is interested in this debate aside from rain, who leaves the forum for weeks at a time every one of his opinions is proven to be obviously wrong. Then he comes back after the first shred of evidence in his favor and spams us until he gets proven wrong again. It's a vicious cycle, but don't feed it, just ignore it!
GET A CLUB TEAM
mmee
Culver City, CA
Post #118
Saturday July 4, 2015 12:18am

Joined Mar 2014
Total Posts: 2,147
Original post from dolcem

No one is interested in this debate aside from rain, who leaves the forum for weeks at a time every one of his opinions is proven to be obviously wrong. Then he comes back after the first shred of evidence in his favor and spams us until he gets proven wrong again. It's a vicious cycle, but don't feed it, just ignore it!


But where will I get my lulz from?

rainORshine
Post #119
Saturday July 4, 2015 12:23am

Joined Dec 2012
Total Posts: 2,097
there are several US CMs better/more deserving than mix

keep watching boys, just keep watching

Mojofc
Post #120
Saturday July 4, 2015 3:31am

Joined Jan 2013
Total Posts: 966
Rain are you a huge JK fan now? I assume you're a convert.

After all... Only games that matter all year were Holland & Germany.
Rain, rain, go away Come again another day - USMNT, MUFC
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