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MSantoine
Post #61
Tuesday September 9, 2014 11:31pm

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 3,723
Original post from 2tone

US into the Semis. They cruised by Slovenia 119-76.

They take on Lithuania in the Semi's.

MSantoine no one is making you watch. There are a lot of people that watch the FIBA WC. The last one drew in 800 million viewers.

The FIBA WC is a very big thing in Eastern European Bloc Countries as well as some Far Eastern countries. Basketball is starting to get bigger and bigger in Brasil and Argentina and in Mexico.

Only Americans say who cares because we just assume the US will win. But from '98 to 2006 the USA didn't win a FIBA WC.

From '59 until '82 the USA didn't win a FIBA WC.

If the US wins this tournament they will have the same amount of FIBA WC titles as Yugoslavia has which is 5.

So, really it's not a given that the US will always win because in the past they haven't always won.

Do Brasilians say who cares to the FIFA WC? No they don't, even though they have won the tournament 5 times.


USA didn't always send pros. That's why it was competitive. Two best recent examples are 1990 and 1998. Both times USA came in 3rd(lost semis crushed in 3rd place game). Both years we didn't send nba players and USA was competitive. The only times there were blowouts usually involved Africa or Asian teams as they hadn't really developed basketball yet. I'd love to see games like that again.

The last two world cups USA has won all 16 games. Only one was by single digits. There average margin of victory is 28 PPG. That's just not fun. It's like if Alabama joined conference USA. Why bother watching.

tylercocinas
Post #62
Wednesday September 10, 2014 1:08am

Joined Aug 2012
Total Posts: 1,151
Original post from 2tone
Do Brasilians say who cares to the FIFA WC? No they don't, even though they have won the tournament 5 times.


Understand your point but not a fair comparison at all. The World Cup is literally the biggest sporting event in the world. Hard to imagine any kids out playing street ball, regardless of the country, dreaming of hitting the game winning shot...at the FIBA World Cup.

tylercocinas
Post #63
Wednesday September 10, 2014 1:10am

Joined Aug 2012
Total Posts: 1,151
Original post from MSantoine
Why bother watching.


Have to agree here. If I happen to be around when a game is being aired, or re-aired I might watch until a commercial break. The only game that will truly be worth your while in terms of actual competitiveness is the final against Spain.

MSantoine
Post #64
Wednesday September 10, 2014 1:43am

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 3,723
Also can't wait for the 2019 addition. They are expanding to 32 teams. If there weren't enough shit box teams already mine as we'll add another 8.

skangles
DC
Post #65
Wednesday September 10, 2014 2:03am

Joined Jan 2013
Total Posts: 5,449
Original post from tylercocinas

Understand your point but not a fair comparison at all. The World Cup is literally the biggest sporting event in the world. Hard to imagine any kids out playing street ball, regardless of the country, dreaming of hitting the game winning shot...at the FIBA World Cup.


Except they do. This is a very big deal in a lot countries and it varies country by country whether the Olympics or World Cup (formerly World Championship which sounds better to me but that's another point) is bigger.

I can personally attest to how much this tournament means to Lithuania. When I moved to Vilnius just before the 2006 World Championship they had converted their TV tower into a giant basketball hoop. They also had a public big screen TV showing the games. In Lithuania kids are absolutely growing up wanting to lead the country to Gold.

My biggest issue with this tournament has been the scheduling. With all teams playing 5 games in 6 days in the Group stages I could only manage to watch the US and Lithuania games and I missed out on a lot of good games between the rest of the field. FIFA absolutely gets it right with a month long celebration of the sport. They schedule it so you can afford to watch random games like South Korea vs Algeria that end up being highly entertaining. The FIBA world cup on the other hand is rushed to fit it all into a two week schedule. Poor planning by FIBA.

I got my wish of Lithuania vs the US, if only it could have been for gold. Lithuania's chances diminished quite a bit when Kalnietis got injured just before the start of the tournament. He was the sole floor general on the team and Lithuania has made it this far with two shooting PGs in Seibutis and Juskevicius and an inferior Vasiliauskas. The latter two players struggle to handle the full court press so the US guards should make a big difference.

Lithuania is definitely the deepest team the US has faced, they went with a 12 man rotation throughout group play and and an 11 man rotation in the two knockout games. Coach K and his staff have been really good at scouting since 2006 and he's seen most of these Lithuanian players before including in their close game in the London Olympics. This is key because Lithuania has some really good players that most US players have never heard of like one of the best SFs in Europe in Jonas Maciulis.

I can definitely say that this is the best Defensive Lithuanian team I've ever seen. They have been tremendous on D. They are a physical team with size that will matchup well with the US. The Lavrinovic brothers are two of the best shooting bigs in this tournament and Valanciunas, Motiejunas and Jankunas like to bang in the paint. As I said the US has a huge advantage at guard and both the US and Lithuania have deadly shooters when they get going. The US are the favorites for a reason but Lithuania is highly capable of giving them a run and can pull off the upset if they shoot well from outside and control the tempo.

2tone
Ten-Towns
Post #66
Wednesday September 10, 2014 2:59am

Joined Jul 2012
Total Posts: 10,605
Original post from MSantoine

USA didn't always send pros. That's why it was competitive. Two best recent examples are 1990 and 1998. Both times USA came in 3rd(lost semis crushed in 3rd place game). Both years we didn't send nba players and USA was competitive. The only times there were blowouts usually involved Africa or Asian teams as they hadn't really developed basketball yet. I'd love to see games like that again.

The last two world cups USA has won all 16 games. Only one was by single digits. There average margin of victory is 28 PPG. That's just not fun. It's like if Alabama joined conference USA. Why bother watching.


OK still doesn't explain why the US didn't win with pros in 2002 and 2006.

It was an amateur competition for every country until 1994. So that massive gap from 58 to 82 is still strange.

2tone
Ten-Towns
Post #67
Wednesday September 10, 2014 3:05am

Joined Jul 2012
Total Posts: 10,605
Original post from tylercocinas

Understand your point but not a fair comparison at all. The World Cup is literally the biggest sporting event in the world. Hard to imagine any kids out playing street ball, regardless of the country, dreaming of hitting the game winning shot...at the FIBA World Cup.


To be honest Americans view the WC different than other countries do. Americans didn't have dreams of playing for their local teams or local league. You take kids from Italy and you ask them what they dream about: my guess it's about playing for Milan or Juventus or Roma and winning the league. In a lot of cases representing their national team in other countries is secondary not primary. Here in the States kids dreamed about playing in the WC because that's what they saw as the pinnacle. Now you have kids dreaming of hitting the game winner in MLS cup.

skangles
DC
Post #68
Wednesday September 10, 2014 5:10am

Joined Jan 2013
Total Posts: 5,449
I forgot to mention in my book of a post that is too long to read, if anybody wants to understand what basketball means to Lithuanians check out The Other Dream Team on Netflix. It's an excellent documentary filmed in a 30 for 30 style although unffiliated with 30 for 30.

You will not be disappointed.

MSantoine
Post #69
Wednesday September 10, 2014 12:35pm

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 3,723
Original post from 2tone

OK still doesn't explain why the US didn't win with pros in 2002 and 2006.

It was an amateur competition for every country until 1994. So that massive gap from 58 to 82 is still strange.


2002 We brought our C- team. That team was filled with NBA journeymen and guys past there prime. 36 year old Reggie Miller, 29 year old Michael Finley, 33 year old Antonio Davis, Raef Lafrentz, Jay Williams, Andre Miller. There were 0 guys who made all NBA 1st or 2nd team. No Mcgrady. No Shaq. No Kobe. No Kidd.

2006 we lost a fluke game to Greece. USA crushed everyone else.

tylercocinas
Post #70
Wednesday September 10, 2014 1:58pm

Joined Aug 2012
Total Posts: 1,151
Original post from skangles
Except they do. This is a very big deal in a lot countries and it varies country by country whether the Olympics or World Cup (formerly World Championship which sounds better to me but that's another point) is bigger.


I wasn't really referring to the Olympics just the World Championships. The popularity of Olympic basketball is indisputable. If given the choice I just think most people would rather win that than a World Cup/Championship. Even in Lithuania, which has long been one of Europes most basketball crazy nations, you'd have a hard time convincing me that this is bigger.

2tone
Ten-Towns
Post #71
Wednesday September 10, 2014 7:45pm

Joined Jul 2012
Total Posts: 10,605
Original post from MSantoine

2002 We brought our C- team. That team was filled with NBA journeymen and guys past there prime. 36 year old Reggie Miller, 29 year old Michael Finley, 33 year old Antonio Davis, Raef Lafrentz, Jay Williams, Andre Miller. There were 0 guys who made all NBA 1st or 2nd team. No Mcgrady. No Shaq. No Kobe. No Kidd.

2006 we lost a fluke game to Greece. USA crushed everyone else.


Shouldn't a USA C-team be able to beat most countries?

Like I said no one is forcing you to watch. But to dismiss the tournament is naÔve. Look what happened: the USA dismissed it for many years, and it bit them in their ass. Now they are taking the tournament seriously.

EKneezy
Atlanta
Post #72
Wednesday September 10, 2014 10:43pm

Joined May 2013
Total Posts: 3,380
HUGE upset by France. What a game

MSantoine
Post #73
Wednesday September 10, 2014 11:32pm

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 3,723
Original post from 2tone

Shouldn't a USA C-team be able to beat most countries?

Like I said no one is forcing you to watch. But to dismiss the tournament is naÔve. Look what happened: the USA dismissed it for many years, and it bit them in their ass. Now they are taking the tournament seriously.


The players don't take it serious so why should we as fans. Where's Lebron? Durant? Love? Howard? Paul? Griffin? Aldridge? Jefferson?

All those players CHOSE not to play. Can you imagine watching a World Cup without Ronaldo, messi, James, pirlo don't play cause they'd rather vacation?? That would make me not watch the World Cup either.

skangles
DC
Post #74
Thursday September 11, 2014 1:17am

Joined Jan 2013
Total Posts: 5,449
Original post from tylercocinas

I wasn't really referring to the Olympics just the World Championships. The popularity of Olympic basketball is indisputable. If given the choice I just think most people would rather win that than a World Cup/Championship. Even in Lithuania, which has long been one of Europes most basketball crazy nations, you'd have a hard time convincing me that this is bigger.


In Lithuania the World Cup / Olympics are comparable but I would agree that if given the choice to win Gold in either the World Cup or Olympics most Lithuanians would choose Olympics. Lithuania is sending their best team to both tournaments and the entire country is watching both events. Should they win this tournament it would lead to massive celebrations.

Wearing the Lithuanian national jersey is hugely important. Sure these guys dream about playing in the NBA but winning Gold for Lithuania is the ultimate goal.

For example Ilgauskas had a great career but he didn't play for Lithuania except for a few times when he was really young and because of this he's not mentioned in the same breath or celebrated like other Lithuanian legends. To be fair he wanted to play in the Beijing Olympics and Lithuania was going to fund his insurance policy but the Cavs refused to let him play. Point being playing for Lithuania means everything to the people of Lithuania.

skangles
DC
Post #75
Thursday September 11, 2014 1:34am

Joined Jan 2013
Total Posts: 5,449
Original post from EKneezy

HUGE upset by France. What a game


And that's why you play the game! What a result!

Can I just say that for somebody who spends a lot of time around the international game Fran Fraschilla sure says a lot of nonsense. How many times has he said "When the US plays Spain in the Final, Spain will be the favorites. I equate Spain's home court to an 8-10 point advantage." He made that comment at least once or twice every US game. Glad he was so certain of the Final during the Group stage.

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