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USAGunner
West Palm Beach
Post #1
Wednesday July 9, 2014 9:59pm

Joined Jul 2013
Total Posts: 192
Since the start of the MLS (1996)...which is really when the USA started getting serious about soccer.

**all of this only includes field players not GK**

The average of a starter for the USMNT players in the World Cup have gone up and down. In the Bad years (1998 and 2006) it has gone up. In the Good years (2002 and 2010) it has gone down.

1998 - 27.2
2002 - 26.5
2006 - 27.5
2010 - 26.8

Generally speaking the trend is older. however the younger the USA is, the better we have done.

This year would have continued the trend, as we were again older this year. Except this year we were MUCH older hitting at 28.8. However if Altidore starts and either Bedoya or Zusi (both are 27) sit then it goes to 28.5.

We also broke the trend of good-bad-good-bad-good. And had a 2nd good WC in a row. However the last time we only had 3 starters that played in the previous WC was 1998.

I'm really thinking that just like 1998, 2014 is the start of a new era for USA soccer. Only this time we are starting off MUCH better, than 1998.

2018 starting roster should probably average somewhere around the high 25 or low 26.

Which is about the age of Germany's starting roster this year, Brazil as well. Netherlands is in the 27 and Argentina is 28's.

I predict that Argentina has 2018 similar to that of Spain 2014. This is also probably the last of the Netherlands run as well as Robben, Sneijder, Van Persie are all 30+.

This is a golden (or at least good) generation for Germany, Belgium, Ghana is young, Nigeria is young, Switzerland, and England. I think Mexico still has a solid group for 2018 as well, they are pretty young.

BUT as we have seen we are as good or better (right now without our upcoming "golden" generation) then everyone but Germany and Belgium. I'm sure Brazil will have a good team as will Italy, but nothing outstanding.
www.westpalmbeachchurchofchrist.com
Dave
Post #2
Thursday July 10, 2014 2:40am

Joined Jul 2014
Total Posts: 34
Looking at our current player pool (only those eligible to play for the US right now) the 23 players I would project for 2018 would have an average age of 27.98. There are some players which could be easily replaced with younger options if a few things fall into place....
Gonzalez, 29.7, Besler 31.4, Lichaj 29.6, Torres 30.6, S. Johnson 29.2,
Replaced w/:
O'Neill 24.8, Zimmerman 25.1, Dean 24.3...Trapp 25.5, Zelalem 21.4, Cropper 25.4

There are a number of quality prospects who could be nearing Sr. National Team call ups. The question is if enough of them will reach their potential to push older players out of the picture.

TheTruth
Post #3
Thursday July 10, 2014 4:15am

Joined Dec 2013
Total Posts: 231
Weird.

MSantoine
Post #4
Thursday July 10, 2014 11:25am

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 2,020
Original post from Dave

Looking at our current player pool (only those eligible to play for the US right now) the 23 players I would project for 2018 would have an average age of 27.98. There are some players which could be easily replaced with younger options if a few things fall into place....
Gonzalez, 29.7, Besler 31.4, Lichaj 29.6, Torres 30.6, S. Johnson 29.2,
Replaced w/:
O'Neill 24.8, Zimmerman 25.1, Dean 24.3...Trapp 25.5, Zelalem 21.4, Cropper 25.4

There are a number of quality prospects who could be nearing Sr. National Team call ups. The question is if enough of them will reach their potential to push older players out of the picture.


Not sure how Lichaj and Torres in their prime with a weaker pool in 2014 don't make it yet you think they'll be there in 2018. Not counting S.Johnson (3rd goalie doesnt matter) Besler is the only one likely to be on the 23 man roster and Omar will have a chance but I wouldnt bet on him.

USAGunner
West Palm Beach
Post #5
Thursday July 10, 2014 1:37pm

Joined Jul 2013
Total Posts: 192
For one it's not overall age of the entire roster. Just the starters. And it doesn't count GK. GK throw the ages off a lot, and don't matter that much. a 35 year old GK is about the same as a 30 year old field player.

I figured something like this for next cycle

Yedlin (25), Brooks (25), Packwood (25) (or similar), Chandler (28)
Bradley (30), Green (23), Gil (24), Zelalem (21)
Altidore (28), Johannson (27)

AVG age = 25.6
Gonzalez for Packwood = 26.0
Torres for Zelalem = 26.3

I think Yedlin, Brooks, Chandler, Bradley, Green, Altidore are pretty obvious and easy choices.

I would imagine with the youngsters coming up that they will fill the other spots and not the older players. So it may not be Packwood, Gil, Zelalem, Johannson...but it will be (IMO) younger players like them. So it wouldn't change the average age too much. I could see a Gonzalez or Besler in as the 2nd CB however. But that could easily be offset if a younger player was to start as the 2nd Striker.
www.westpalmbeachchurchofchrist.com
MSantoine
Post #6
Thursday July 10, 2014 2:19pm

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 2,020
If you were handicapping the field I think that Fab would definitely be favored to be in the starting lineup. He'll be 30 next world cup. Besler will be 31. But those two in for Packwood and Zelalem (not a us citizen, may never be). and your looking at an average age of 27.1 which is more realistic.

In fact Id say there's a better chance of Aron/Jozy not being there then Fab and Besler.

USAGunner
West Palm Beach
Post #7
Thursday July 10, 2014 5:56pm

Joined Jul 2013
Total Posts: 192
Original post from MSantoine

If you were handicapping the field I think that Fab would definitely be favored to be in the starting lineup. He'll be 30 next world cup. Besler will be 31. But those two in for Packwood and Zelalem (not a us citizen, may never be). and your looking at an average age of 27.1 which is more realistic.

In fact Id say there's a better chance of Aron/Jozy not being there then Fab and Besler.


That last statement is definitely not fact FYI.

Jozy has the best chance of the 4 you listed as being there in 2018 (And Starting). He was a starter the last 2 world Cups and still still only be 28. Not sure why people think he is suddenly going to be gone. He is one of them that Jurgen is building around.

Sorry I just don't buy the Hype of Besler. Think he'll be a one and done, like most of our CBs. I can see Fabian being on the roster, I just don't think he'll hold off Yedlin and/or Chandler. Both of them SHOULD improve much more than Fabian does over the next 4 years. They have much more room to grow than he does. Now Johnson could move over to the Left side.

Also I'm pretty sure ALL of the reports are that Zelalem got his US citizenship, and it is well known that he wants to play for the Stars and Stripes (his own words). So I'm under the impression its pretty much a done deal that he will be part of the US set up for the 2018 cycle. If he is, I don't think there is much doubt in many's minds that he will be a starter, if not the best player for that team.
www.westpalmbeachchurchofchrist.com
blaise213
San Francisco CA
Post #8
Thursday July 10, 2014 6:21pm

Joined Sep 2012
Total Posts: 1,289
We need a leftback really bad ! Always has been our achilles heel position!

Definitely hoping for klinsmann to recruit Jeremey Toljan and give Greg Garza a look.

USAGunner
West Palm Beach
Post #9
Thursday July 10, 2014 6:31pm

Joined Jul 2013
Total Posts: 192
Original post from blaise213

We need a leftback really bad ! Always has been our achilles heel position!

Definitely hoping for klinsmann to recruit Jeremey Toljan and give Greg Garza a look.


Agree. Still don't get why Lichaj isn't part of the set-up. About the only natural American LB.
www.westpalmbeachchurchofchrist.com
admsghs27
Post #10
Thursday July 10, 2014 6:36pm

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 2,900
Usa lacks 4 positions really bad. A top notch LB, 2 wingers that can actually play as WINGERS. And a true 10 in the midfield.

MSantoine
Post #11
Thursday July 10, 2014 9:09pm

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 2,020
Original post from USAGunner

That last statement is definitely not fact FYI.

Jozy has the best chance of the 4 you listed as being there in 2018 (And Starting). He was a starter the last 2 world Cups and still still only be 28. Not sure why people think he is suddenly going to be gone. He is one of them that Jurgen is building around.

Sorry I just don't buy the Hype of Besler. Think he'll be a one and done, like most of our CBs. I can see Fabian being on the roster, I just don't think he'll hold off Yedlin and/or Chandler. Both of them SHOULD improve much more than Fabian does over the next 4 years. They have much more room to grow than he does. Now Johnson could move over to the Left side.

Also I'm pretty sure ALL of the reports are that Zelalem got his US citizenship, and it is well known that he wants to play for the Stars and Stripes (his own words). So I'm under the impression its pretty much a done deal that he will be part of the US set up for the 2018 cycle. If he is, I don't think there is much doubt in many's minds that he will be a starter, if not the best player for that team.


If you read what I said I said in Fact I'd say, implying it was my opinion and not a fact. If it were a fact I'd say fact- Jozy wont start in 2018.

But anyways you cant think of things in a vacuum. Yes jozy is better than besler now. And Jozy is young than Besler. And Jozy will most likely be better than Besler in 2018. However Look at the CB pool and look at the striker pool.

CB pool after Brooks- Besler, Omar, Goodson, Cameron (?), Packwood (Champions league guy, injury prone), O'Neil (MLSer with no caps), Okogu (Development stalled). We're not oozing with CB talent.

Attacker pool- Jozy, Aron, Boyd, Agudelo, Zardes, Villareal, Green, Parker.

Hell some people think Agudelo is already better suited for USA than Jozy.

Jozy can, and is the current leader to be the striker in Russia, but he has way more competition than Besler.

Know Nothing
Post #12
Thursday July 10, 2014 9:11pm

Joined Jan 2013
Total Posts: 324
Original post from USAGunner

Also I'm pretty sure ALL of the reports are that Zelalem got his US citizenship, and it is well known that he wants to play for the Stars and Stripes (his own words). So I'm under the impression its pretty much a done deal that he will be part of the US set up for the 2018 cycle. If he is, I don't think there is much doubt in many's minds that he will be a starter, if not the best player for that team.


Spoken with red tinted glasses of course. Zelalem is a talent, but I think we are over estimating him at this time because he made the bench at Arsenal during a stretch where their midfield was beset by injuries.

TheTruth
Post #13
Thursday July 10, 2014 9:22pm

Joined Dec 2013
Total Posts: 231
Original post from USAGunner

That last statement is definitely not fact FYI.

Jozy has the best chance of the 4 you listed as being there in 2018 (And Starting). He was a starter the last 2 world Cups and still still only be 28. Not sure why people think he is suddenly going to be gone. He is one of them that Jurgen is building around.

Sorry I just don't buy the Hype of Besler. Think he'll be a one and done, like most of our CBs. I can see Fabian being on the roster, I just don't think he'll hold off Yedlin and/or Chandler. Both of them SHOULD improve much more than Fabian does over the next 4 years. They have much more room to grow than he does. Now Johnson could move over to the Left side.

Also I'm pretty sure ALL of the reports are that Zelalem got his US citizenship, and it is well known that he wants to play for the Stars and Stripes (his own words). So I'm under the impression its pretty much a done deal that he will be part of the US set up for the 2018 cycle. If he is, I don't think there is much doubt in many's minds that he will be a starter, if not the best player for that team.


Slow down there tiger. Uh, you do know that 2018 is four years away, right?

USAGunner
West Palm Beach
Post #14
Thursday July 10, 2014 9:42pm

Joined Jul 2013
Total Posts: 192
Original post from MSantoine

If you read what I said I said in Fact I'd say, implying it was my opinion and not a fact. If it were a fact I'd say fact- Jozy wont start in 2018.

But anyways you cant think of things in a vacuum. Yes jozy is better than besler now. And Jozy is young than Besler. And Jozy will most likely be better than Besler in 2018. However Look at the CB pool and look at the striker pool.

CB pool after Brooks- Besler, Omar, Goodson, Cameron (?), Packwood (Champions league guy, injury prone), O'Neil (MLSer with no caps), Okogu (Development stalled). We're not oozing with CB talent.

Attacker pool- Jozy, Aron, Boyd, Agudelo, Zardes, Villareal, Green, Parker.

Hell some people think Agudelo is already better suited for USA than Jozy.

Jozy can, and is the current leader to be the striker in Russia, but he has way more competition than Besler.


But here is the kicker. I'm not talking about my opinion. I'm going off of what we know JK thinks of Altidore. Which is higher than just about ANY of us. Jurgen has an extremely high opinion of Altidore. Jurgen doesn't think Agudelo is anywhere CLOSE to Altidore. Really he doesn't think any of them are. Jurgen apparently doesn't think too highly of Agudelo. Surely you meant Boyd there, not Agudelo. I can't imagine anyone thinking Agudelo is better than Altidore right now. Boyd, sure, I can see that. Don't agree but I can see it.

People aren't just going to have to be "better" than Altidore. They are going to have to be much better and fit the team better.

Realistically you can throw most of those guys off of the list as JK likes the Holding Forward role, with another striker playing off of him. So really it's down to Altidore, Boyd, and Agudelo. Most of the competition is going to be for the other spot. Altidore is also a leader with loads of experience.

For someone to replace Altidore and Bradley, they aren't just going to have to better, they are going to have to be MUCH better, as to overcome the leadership/experience. And Really they are going to have to do that in the next 3 years. If they haven't overcome Altidore or Bradley by the summer of 2017, then you can forget about it.

Again this isn't how highly I think of Altidore. But going off of what we know Jurgen thinks of him. Which again is higher than what most of us think of him.
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TheTruth
Post #15
Friday July 11, 2014 4:08am

Joined Dec 2013
Total Posts: 231
Your solipsism is nauseating.

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