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skangles
DC
Post #1
Tuesday June 10, 2014 1:41am

Joined Jan 2013
Total Posts: 1,964
Klinsmann has been under fire over his we cannot win the World Cup comment and Kenya Brown has a piece on it in the Short Corner. My take on this is that it's an unnecessary comment. Probably true but I don't think the MNT needs any additional motivation if that is what he is intending.

I also didn't like it during the first episode of Bennett's documentary when Klinsmann told the German media that Germany will for sure go through. They're obviously the best and should be positioned to go through but Klinsmann really needs to start believing that he is going to take three points from Germany so if Germany want to go through they best get their points against Portugal and Ghana. I don't think he needs to say that to the media but he needs to believe it.

While I don't think Klinsmann is handling himself all that well in the media with these comments I am confident that he will do everything he can do to put the US in the best position possible and these comments do not deter from him doing his job to the best of his ability. I think he would love to get a result against Germany to prove to the pundits that the 2006 run wasn't due to Loewe with Juergen just the talking head.

While I find Klinsmann's comments a bit annoying but nothing else, I am really quite pissed off with the comments of Berti Vogts.


Berti Vogts may have been recently appointed to serve as a special advisor to the U.S Men's National Team at this summer's World Cup, but that does not mean he will be rooting for the Americans in Brazil.

Vogts reportedly admitted in an interview earlier this month that he will be supporting his native Germany at this summer's tournament despite the fact that the European powerhouse will face the Americans in their final Group G match on June 26. The 67-year-old Vogts - who won a World Cup with Germany as a player before becoming its manager - said that he will be offering U.S. head coach Jurgen Klinsmann as much advice as he can, but that he does not intend to root for anyone but Germany.

"I do not know what people think," said Vogts, who is also currently the head coach of Azerbaijan. "That I (am) now the great enemy of the Germans because I advise Jurgen Klinsmann? I'll sit in Brazil in the stands and hope that Germany is world champion., and I will certainly not cheer when the U.S. score a goal against us."

Vogts was named a special advisor by Klinsmann back on March 30, and the two are currently in Miami along with scout Matthias Hamann to scout Ghana during its friendly vs. Korea Republic. The U.S. opens the World Cup against Ghana on June 16 before playing Portugal and Germany.

There is no denying that the Americans' three group stage opponents have talent, but Vogts believes that the skill those teams possess will require the U.S. to be as fit as possible in order to have any shot of at advancing from a Group G that many observers consider the Group of Death.

"Of course, Germany, Ghana and Portugal are superior to Americans in footballing terms," said Vogts. "That is why the U.S. team must (have) top-driven (work rates). Their advantage is that Americans know the heat. That's why I advised Jurgen in preparation for a high-running intensity in training. You need to play to this advantage."

Vogts will offer more tips like that to Klinsmann in Brazil, but that is far as his support will go for the Americans.

"Now he called me and invited to be with the team during the World Cup," said Vogts. "If he has any questions, I will answer them. That's all."

http://www.soccerbyives.net/2014/06/report-us...


I assume he's being paid by US Soccer for his special advisory role and I thought he was going to be scouting other teams. If his special advice is "it's hot in Brazil" I give up.

aaron
Post #2
Tuesday June 10, 2014 2:38am

Joined Sep 2013
Total Posts: 14
Very interesting remarks...perhaps this is an argument in favor of hiring only American coaches (which I am not actually sold on). Although, in reality, if he is only an "adviser" to Klinsmann, I suppose so long as he gives the right advice, he doesn't have to be on the sidelines cheering us on. I mean, if his job description is simply to offer accurate and beneficial advising regarding specific matters, and he follows through on that end of the bargain, then he's fulfilled his duties.

The only question is, can we trust him? I mean, we are playing against the team he'll be cheering for, after all.

MSantoine
Post #3
Tuesday June 10, 2014 3:01am

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 2,184
I don't see what the problem is in jk's statement. It would be like in college hoops if someone asked grumbling state or unc Asheville if they thought they could win the title. Of course they won't. There goal would be win 1 game. Maybe make the sweet sixteen. No way would they honestly think they could win the title. It's the same with USA now. Quarterfinals is our goal. If he said he thought we should win the title and didn't he'd get crap for underachieving. I hate the media. They are such two faced asshats.

stone88
Post #4
Tuesday June 10, 2014 3:05am

Joined Aug 2012
Total Posts: 840
Vogts is a waste of space on the US coaching staff. With those type of comments I expect him to be more of a spy/saboteur than a productive and trustworthy US advisor.

Hey guys I'm a Coke Executive, but Pepsi is better and the only thing I drink is Pepsi, "long live Pepsi Co., Thanks for the check Coke!"

skangles
DC
Post #5
Tuesday June 10, 2014 3:30am

Joined Jan 2013
Total Posts: 1,964
The part that really gets to me is that Vogts took this position well after the groups were known. He knew Germany was in our group.

When Juergen approached him about advising the US had he declined because his heart is with Germany I think that would have been commendable but to accept the position when he clearly has a conflict of interest is insulting to US soccer, the US fans and Klinsmann himself.

I get that Germany is always going to have a soft spot for him (and Juergen too for that matter) but if he cannot get past it as a professional then he has no business in international football outside of the Fussball Bund. There are plenty of options at the club level.

cleancutimage
Post #6
Tuesday June 10, 2014 4:38am

Joined Oct 2013
Total Posts: 158
Also, I did not like the fact that Vogts did not help us out in the Azerbijan game. He could have tried to play more of any open game than to sit back and have 11 players behind the ball the entire match. He knew those type of tactics would not help us out because none of the teams we will play will sit 11 players behind the ball. I realize they do not have the personnel but at least make it more of an open and entertaining match. This is sounding like a joke of a decision by JK. But yeah like was mentioned earlier, as long as he gives the right advice it doesn't matter who he will cheer for.
Plus he didn't say anything anyone did not already know. Our best attribute is our fitness, at this point no we cannot out class teams like Germany, Portugal and even Ghana with our technical ability but he made it seem like we were technically incapable of playing with these teams. We have some players that are very technical.

skangles
DC
Post #7
Tuesday June 10, 2014 4:45am

Joined Jan 2013
Total Posts: 1,964
Here's a fun fact Germany and Azerbaijan were in the same Group for the 2010 WCQ and 2012 Euro qualifiers whilst Vogts was in charge of Azerbaijan.

Germany won 2-0 and 4-0 in 2009 and 6-1 and 3-1 in 2010 and 2011. Did Vogts cheer when Azerbaijan scored or would that make him a great enemy of Germany?

dfw_fan
DfW
Post #8
Tuesday June 10, 2014 5:51am

Joined Apr 2013
Total Posts: 425
Take a chill pill for the cause people... take it easy

MSantoine
Post #9
Tuesday June 10, 2014 10:30am

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 2,184
People need to relax. Think of it this way. If Canada hired you to be a scout would you not still want USA to be successful? I think we'd all say yes to that one. Now take the fact that he lived and bled German colors for 70 years AND represented them AND won the most prestigious tournament with them. You wouldn't still want your country to succeed? He's not an assistant coach. He's a scout. I don't think he'll even be on the sideline

Kamphgruppe
Michigan
Post #10
Tuesday June 10, 2014 11:23am

Joined Jul 2012
Total Posts: 277
You guys are overthinking this. Of course he is going to cheer for Germany, he is German and played for their national team. I grew up in a household that cheered for University of Michigan. I was Maze and Blue through and through and still am. However after two years of Junior college I got offered a wrestling scholarship to "gasp" Michigan State. I took it of course and wrestled for State for two years. I attended Michigan State but still rooted for U of M in all sports. I did my best when we wrestled U of M wanted to win etc. I still wanted U of M to do well etc. There is no conflict of interest, he will do his job to the best of his ability, then root for his home nation.

MSantoine
Post #11
Tuesday June 10, 2014 11:34am

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 2,184
Original post from stone88

Vogts is a waste of space on the US coaching staff. With those type of comments I expect him to be more of a spy/saboteur than a productive and trustworthy US advisor.

Hey guys I'm a Coke Executive, but Pepsi is better and the only thing I drink is Pepsi, "long live Pepsi Co., Thanks for the check Coke!"


Your analogy is wrong. It would be like you worked your way up the ladded at Coke for 40 years. Then retired. Then Pepsi offered you a consultant job. Coke didn't offer you a consultant job. You accept the job with Pepsi but cant pretend you didnt work your way up through coca cola and are a Coke drinker for life

skangles
DC
Post #12
Tuesday June 10, 2014 1:27pm

Joined Jan 2013
Total Posts: 1,964
I expect our scouts to point out what the opposition does well and often so that we can plan for it as well as identify their weaknesses so that we can exploit them.

Vogts publicly stated he wants us to fail in 33% of our chances.

If you were trying to increase your company's market share and hired a consulting firm whereby the lead consultant spent their career with your main competitor and then delivered a strategy whilst commenting that they hope you do not succeed wouldn't that be a conflict of interest? Would you take their strategy seriously?

jtsccr12
Post #13
Tuesday June 10, 2014 1:47pm

Joined May 2013
Total Posts: 80
Maybe JK feels as though he needs Vogts for Ghana and Portugal, and that he can handle Germany on his own. For a coach that has kept everything pretty tight to the chest, I highly doubt he lets Vogts in the room per-Germany if he feels he is either conflicted or willing to relay gameplans to the Germans.

Kamphgruppe
Michigan
Post #14
Tuesday June 10, 2014 1:54pm

Joined Jul 2012
Total Posts: 277
Original post from skangles

I expect our scouts to point out what the opposition does well and often so that we can plan for it as well as identify their weaknesses so that we can exploit them.

Vogts publicly stated he wants us to fail in 33% of our chances.

If you were trying to increase your company's market share and hired a consulting firm whereby the lead consultant spent their career with your main competitor and then delivered a strategy whilst commenting that they hope you do not succeed wouldn't that be a conflict of interest? Would you take their strategy seriously?


He said he would not cheer when US scored a goal vs. Germany, that is a far cry from wanting us to fail.

hamsamwich
Post #15
Tuesday June 10, 2014 2:11pm

Joined Oct 2013
Total Posts: 510
Also said "when", not "if". Vogts' Azerbaijan was designed to simulate us attacking a side sitting behind the ball.... a likely occurrence if a team scores against us and sits back to keep all 3 points. You people are suprisingly confused and wrong. What can be bad about having a WC winning coach as an assistant??

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