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camparkinson
Post #106
Monday April 28, 2014 7:04pm

Joined Aug 2012
Total Posts: 168
I really hope you're right 2tone, been dying to see Besler/Cameron for a long time and just feel like a lot of time has been wasted on Gonzalez.

richieJkulesaNY
Post #107
Monday April 28, 2014 7:37pm

Joined Jun 2012
Total Posts: 933
For everybody that wants to see Cameron at CB, what are you coming up with that says he's better than Gonzo?

Go and watch the highlights of the friendly at Azteca. He has a lot of trouble picking up players on the run. Chicharito should of had a couple goals for Mexico. He looked shaky against Honduras too.

The only reason why you guys want Cameron is because you havent seen him in a long time and he's the next logical choice. He does not play CB for club and he hasnt been convincing at CB for the US.

Also, not the best time to start shaking up things.

Chrisou101
Post #108
Monday April 28, 2014 7:40pm

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 554
Original post from camparkinson

I really hope you're right 2tone, been dying to see Besler/Cameron for a long time and just feel like a lot of time has been wasted on Gonzalez.
Well we did see them against Jamaicam they were solid defensively and were calm playing out of the back.

admsghs27
Post #109
Monday April 28, 2014 8:01pm

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 3,014
Cameron is worse than Gonzo at CB idk where people are getting this ideas. Why play someone out of position who plays day in an out at RB for his club. Is like saying lets put Besler at wing or Donovan at DM, or Altidore at RB. Won't work.

2tone
Ten-Towns
Post #110
Monday April 28, 2014 8:05pm

Joined Jul 2012
Total Posts: 4,922
Original post from admsghs27

Cameron is worse than Gonzo at CB idk where people are getting this ideas. Why play someone out of position who plays day in an out at RB for his club. Is like saying lets put Besler at wing or Donovan at DM, or Altidore at RB. Won't work.


Nope. And Klinsmann has stated multiple times that he doesn't care that Cameron is playing RB at Stoke he see's him as a CB.

IMO Cameron has always been better than Gonzo at CB.

Jzaval01
Post #111
Monday April 28, 2014 8:29pm

Joined May 2013
Total Posts: 1,436
Cameron imo is an emergency CB. Positions he should be in is CDM or RB

navi8132
Post #112
Monday April 28, 2014 8:34pm

Joined Jul 2012
Total Posts: 1,903
Hard to justify Cameron at CB with only one good CB performance for USMNT when Goodson has been solid for USMNT for 8+ games.

navi8132
Post #113
Monday April 28, 2014 8:43pm

Joined Jul 2012
Total Posts: 1,903
And that he doesn't play club CB. At least for RB he plays club there.

rainORshine
Post #114
Tuesday April 29, 2014 4:11am

Joined Dec 2012
Total Posts: 1,770
JK does have a history of starting 21 y/o CBs at WCs... mertesacker was 21 in 06

heres how i would look at it... who will your LCB be in 2018? brooks or besler? ill take whoever is more likely...

if brooks were an 18 y/o winger starting at hertha everyone would be wanting him to start. he is by far the best under 22 prodigy at the moment (as in right now). who cares if he happens to be a defender. turn him loose (or at least start him v turkey with full team and see how it looks)

tjknowsall
Post #115
Tuesday April 29, 2014 4:48am

Joined May 2013
Total Posts: 283
i agree we should start besler and brooks in the preseason friendlies until it doesnt work...

433
Post #116
Tuesday April 29, 2014 6:43am

Joined Apr 2014
Total Posts: 29
Cameron is better as a RB than a CB. For one thing, he's a decent crosser of the ball, and playing him at CB would take away one area of his game that is a strength.

The other reason he's a better RB than CB is that his defensive skills leave a bit to be desired, and if I'm gonna have a player that's prone to switching off I'd rather it be my RB than my CB. (If your RB makes an error one of the CBs can cover. When your CB switches off, it's a 1-on-1 with the keeper.)

That said, I don't rate Gonzalez. At all.

Lilshmike
Post #117
Tuesday April 29, 2014 1:24pm

Joined Oct 2012
Total Posts: 504
Original post from admsghs27

Cameron is worse than Gonzo at CB idk where people are getting this ideas. Why play someone out of position who plays day in an out at RB for his club. Is like saying lets put Besler at wing or Donovan at DM, or Altidore at RB. Won't work.


Beasley plays LW at Puebla, and LB for the USMNT. That works.

Evans plays CM for Seattle, and RB for the USMNT. That has worked.

Parkhurst plays CB for Columbus, and LB/RB for the USMNT. Again, that has worked.

Point blank, Cameron is wayyyyy better than Gonzalez at any position on the field.

Lilshmike
Post #118
Tuesday April 29, 2014 1:35pm

Joined Oct 2012
Total Posts: 504
Original post from 433

Cameron is better as a RB than a CB. For one thing, he's a decent crosser of the ball, and playing him at CB would take away one area of his game that is a strength.

The other reason he's a better RB than CB is that his defensive skills leave a bit to be desired, and if I'm gonna have a player that's prone to switching off I'd rather it be my RB than my CB. (If your RB makes an error one of the CBs can cover. When your CB switches off, it's a 1-on-1 with the keeper.)

That said, I don't rate Gonzalez. At all.


Completely agree.

Cameron COULD be a good CB for the USMNT, but at this point in time, he is much better as a RB. He has played RB for so long, that it would not make sense to change him this close before the WC.

Gonzalez is shit. Goodson is much better, and he has more experience. Hell, I will even go as far as saying that Onyewu is still better than Gonzalez. Gonzalez IS NOT good enough to be a starting international CB at the WC. He just isn't.

Against top international competition, he will be exposed. He makes too many mistakes, he is too slow, and he is not coordinated enough. Faster players will blow by him. Smaller, shiftier players will be able to dribble around him. his only redeeming quality is his size and heading ability. But there is more to being a CB than strength, height, and clearing/being a target on set pieces.

Starting CBs should be Besler and Goodson.

Brooks is Besler's backup. Gonzalez (or Cameron) is Goodson's backup.

Lilshmike
Post #119
Tuesday April 29, 2014 1:55pm

Joined Oct 2012
Total Posts: 504
Here is the thing, Gonzalez is so one-dimensional that he can ONLY play RCB.

He can't play LCB because he has no left foot and he is not a good enough player to be able to adjust to both sides of the field. He actually can't play that position. He never has, and he never will.

Gonzalez is not good enough RIGHT NOW to be our starting CB. Here are people that, in reality, are better at RCB.

Goodson - No question.
Cameron - Yea, he plays RB, but he is still a better CB than Gonzalez.
Onyewu - People may say no about this, but he is. He is a slightly slower, better skilled, incredibly more experienced (he has played in 22 WCs and he has played Champions League) version of Gonzalez. We can find ways to cover for his slowness, but his experience is invaluable.
Edu - He may not be a CB, but the only thing that Gonzalez is better at than Edu is with his strength and height. Their tackling ability is comparable. Everything else defensively, Edu is better. Everything else offensively, Edu is better. Period.
Orozco-Fiscal - I will not say that he is better. Him and Gonzalez are comparable. Both have something to offer that the other doesn't. I don't think that having one on the field instead of the other would make much of a difference.

And here are the wild cards...

Beckerman - He is a good tackler, he has strength, he can pass decently. He is a reliable player who does not make many mistakes. I don't think he is the best player we have, but when called on, he does his job. I think that if Beckerman was placed at RCB, he would do fine. Maybe even better an Gonzalez. Only problem is his height, which could be an issue.
Jones - Honestly, he is the best defensive player we have. He is strong, good in the air, can distribute, and is a good tackler. He would absolutely play CB, and play it better than Gonzalez. His only issue, he is prone to committing a few fouls each game. Thats not a bad thing, but it could be in front of the box. If he could refrain from that, and keep himself from pushing too far up the field, he may actually be the best CB option we have.

Lilshmike
Post #120
Tuesday April 29, 2014 2:29pm

Joined Oct 2012
Total Posts: 504
Original post from tjknowsall

i agree we should start besler and brooks in the preseason friendlies until it doesnt work...


Brooks and Besler SHOULD NOT play beside one another. They should only play LCB, and only one of them can do that. Here is why.

Both play LCB for club. Both are left footed. Because of this, both have a natural tendency to play to their left. While possessing the ball, both will use their dominant foot. When looking for a pass, the first option they will look for will be to the left because it is not only natural, but it will likely require a pass from their left foot which will be much easier to complete. When making a tackle, the foot that they will look to use first will be their left.

Because of this, playing them alongside each other at CB will cause A LOT of issues. Lets assume Brooks plays at RCB.

First, whenever he would get the ball, he would have that natural tendency to push it to the left. At RCB, this means that he is going to move the ball into the center of the field, ACROSS the face of the goal. That is how mistakes happen and goals get scored. The ball needs to be pushed outside, away from goal. If you are right footed, and you play RCB, pushing the ball outside to the right is easy and natural. Brooks is not.

Second, he will probably try to find an immediate pass to his left. That is fine SOMETIMES, but again, it moves the ball across the goal which is extremely dangerous. If it is a bad pass, well then he has just given the ball away in front of in the middle of the field to an attacker that is directly in front of goal.

Third, since there would be 2 left footed CBs on the field, there would again be a natural tendency to push possession to the left.The left side of the field would be our dominant side moving out of the defense. If a team cuts off that option, then it puts us in a very bad spot and will make it harder for us to move forward. Additionally, teams will look to attack our right side as a result. Since the right is not natural for our CBs, it puts our RB (Cameron) essentially on an island. Not only that, but world class players that we will play against will try to attack that weakness and exploit Brooks' (or Besler's) inexperience.

Fourth, since his natural tendency is to tackle with his left foot, what do you think will happen when these world class players attack his right side? Well, he will be dramatically more likely to give up a foul or miss a tackle. This is because he will either try to tackle with his left when he should tackle with his right, or he will use his less effective right foot. Giving up a foul or missing a tackle in, or around, the box may result in a goal.

If Besler and Brooks were to play alongside each other, Besler should be LB and Brooks be LCB. Not both at CB.

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