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Dam
Chandler, AZ
Post #16
Friday October 11, 2013 5:56am

Joined Aug 2013
Total Posts: 40
The possibility of JK for a second Cycle will depend on the results we get in Brazil.
However, whoever the coach in 2018 may be, the coach will have very few players that will have to be replaced (Jones, Donovan, Dempsey, Cherundolo, Beasley, Goodson) and a LOT of very talented players to build around (Guzan, F. Johnson, Bradley, Jozy, Johannsson, Besler, Gonzalez, Brooks, Chandler, Lichaj, Gatt, Yedlin, Ferrell, Powers, Williams, Gil, Packwood, and many others).

MSantoine
Post #17
Friday October 11, 2013 11:33am

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 3,723
I wonder if we flame out in the group stage if it will be like Bradley after the 06 cycle. Quietly see whos available (leak some big names to press to get attention) and if a top guy wants the job make the change, if not bring back JK.

rainORshine
Post #18
Friday October 11, 2013 1:12pm

Joined Dec 2012
Total Posts: 2,097
Original post from MSantoine

I wonder if we flame out in the group stage if it will be like Bradley after the 06 cycle. Quietly see whos available (leak some big names to press to get attention) and if a top guy wants the job make the change, if not bring back JK.


id like to think a group stage exit would prompt a change.
obviously a QF run would be a success

most likely scenario is a 2nd place group stage followed by a loss in round of 16.

in that case i would hope JKs entire record against top opponents and the decisions he ultimately makes at WC would be heavily scrutinized - there will decisions to make at just about every position

i imagine he would be retained, but i would like to think it is not because getting out of WC group is considered a rousing success at this point. would like to see the mentality about getting out of group change from big success to expectation - if it happens in brazil will be 4th time in last 7 and i think this program has reached a point of going in with that expectation

at this point i would say that getting to a QF if there is a "reasonable" path (like playing a team like ghana, for instance) is the goal at this point

MSantoine
Post #19
Friday October 11, 2013 2:46pm

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 3,723
Original post from rainORshine

id like to think a group stage exit would prompt a change.
obviously a QF run would be a success

most likely scenario is a 2nd place group stage followed by a loss in round of 16.

in that case i would hope JKs entire record against top opponents and the decisions he ultimately makes at WC would be heavily scrutinized - there will decisions to make at just about every position

i imagine he would be retained, but i would like to think it is not because getting out of WC group is considered a rousing success at this point. would like to see the mentality about getting out of group change from big success to expectation - if it happens in brazil will be 4th time in last 7 and i think this program has reached a point of going in with that expectation

at this point i would say that getting to a QF if there is a "reasonable" path (like playing a team like ghana, for instance) is the goal at this point


I agree. For me success is a QF appearance. To compare it to the other american sports, group stage elimination would be like being upset by a lower seed in first round if your the heat, spurs, patriots, teams that always make the playoffs as top 3 seeds. Yes you made the playoffs but your disappointed with how it ended. Losing in the first knockout round would be losing in the conf semis. Not a disapointment but nothing that you'll remember in future years. Making the QF would be like making a super bowl. Any time your in the big game its a success. QF appearance would be that for us. Winning that QF game would be just like winning the superbowl. Making the finals would be like the biggest underdog winning a superbowl. And winning the World Cup would be like the apocalypse and greatest achievement in american sports history

recycledhumans
DFWTX
Post #20
Friday October 11, 2013 3:51pm

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 1,467
I don't know if a World Cup win could objectively beat the Miracle on Ice for Greatest Sporting Achievement in American History...we could argue both sides for sure, but given the larger political and global context of '86, I think the Miracle wins. A WC win would probably tie the Jesse Owens '36 Olympics for 2nd Greatest.

If we were to win the WC final in Brazil, against Brazil, then I would say that there is no argument about it being the Greatest, doesn't matter what biases one may have.

MSantoine
Post #21
Friday October 11, 2013 3:53pm

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 3,723
Original post from recycledhumans

I don't know if a World Cup win could objectively beat the Miracle on Ice for Greatest Sporting Achievement in American History...we could argue both sides for sure, but given the larger political and global context of '86, I think the Miracle wins. A WC win would probably tie the Jesse Owens '36 Olympics for 2nd Greatest.

If we were to win the WC final in Brazil, against Brazil, then I would say that there is no argument about it being the Greatest, doesn't matter what biases one may have.


Good points. Cant argue against miracle on ice. Ill rephrase it to be the greatest PROFESSIONAL moment in american sports

richieJkulesaNY
Post #22
Friday October 11, 2013 4:32pm

Joined Jun 2012
Total Posts: 1,016
Original post from 2tone

I think he will be the front runner regardless. The amount of talent that is coming for the 2018 cycle will be ridiculous.

I would say that this USMNT cycle is a transition team to be honest, and always has been.

Klinsmann can better implement his style from the get go during the 2018 WC cycle, and he is going to have the talent to do it.

I fully support Klinsmann as head coach for the 2018 WC cycle.


The question is will Klinsmann hang on to some of these "transition" players for too long into the next cycle? We all know he likes to play favorites.

I am all for keeping Klinsmann a part of the USSF, but it could be in the team's best interest to have a new coaching staff.

At the very least, if he stays on as "head coach", he needs to replace Vasquez.

MSantoine
Post #23
Friday October 11, 2013 5:10pm

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 3,723
Original post from richieJkulesaNY

The question is will Klinsmann hang on to some of these "transition" players for too long into the next cycle? We all know he likes to play favorites.

I am all for keeping Klinsmann a part of the USSF, but it could be in the team's best interest to have a new coaching staff.

At the very least, if he stays on as "head coach", he needs to replace Vasquez.


Exactly. Guys like Beckerman, Beasley, Goodson, EJ, Evans, Davis, Herc should not be btought into camps anymore. I appreciate what they did but they wont be able to help come 2018. I hope JK is willing and able to cut the cord completely instead of bringing them through the 2015 gold cup and 2016 1st WCQ. If hes not I dont want him here

dolcem
Post #24
Saturday October 12, 2013 8:30am

Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts: 1,805
This World Cup will have millions of new viewers (and most of the current fans are very new to the sport). Their expectations are quite high and our success in their eyes will ultimately determine Jurgen's fate. Sunil wants to keep him but if there's a group stage exit people will call for his head...he's not American and is a very easy target, not to mention, a lot of American coaches and even some journalists I think would hate to see stick around after 2014 (and they'll be vocal about this).

What will be interesting is if we get drawn into a really tough group, play well, but don't make it out. Sunil would want to keep him but would the American public accept it? I don't know. A lot of it would have to do with the names of the teams in the group. Some of the top teams in the world (Belgium, for example) don't impress Americans who don't follow the sport closely because they aren't familiar with the players, while other teams are incredibly overrated because they're famous for being good (England).

I can't believe some of the responses on here...that people actually think a QF appearance is realistic. It's not going to happen. No way we are anywhere near top 8. For those of us who just started watching, the group stage seems like it's not even an accomplishment, but for us, getting out of it would be massive. We are definitely not a top 16 team (yes, we're ranked 13th, but those rankings are bullshit). Now if we're in an easy group than it wouldn't be such a huge accomplishment but still we'd be thrilled. Lots of great teams don't make it out of the group stage: anything can happen. No way we'll get anything nearly as easy as last WC's (or our round of 16 opponent, for that matter) but I'm keeping my fingers crossed.

As long as popular pressure isn't too strong I'd love for JK to stick around. He's done a great job so far and has all the right ideas. More importantly, we have no other options. No other good managers would want to take charge of us, and certainly none with Klinsmann's loyalty to us. The only really good American manager at the moment is Kreis, and I don't think he's quite ready (we have a lot of time for him and we can hire him later, after he's had a bit more experience). That leaves us with JK. Whatever happens I really, really hope he takes up some role as a technical director after he steps down as the head coach. That's what he's really good at.
GET A CLUB TEAM
hamsamwich
Post #25
Saturday October 12, 2013 3:19pm

Joined Oct 2013
Total Posts: 3,212
what Jurgen brings that others have not is a certain "clout" within the soccer industry around the world. he can call managers and whoever all over the world and he gets respect. I liked bradley, but he didnt command any respect. see the fact that he had to go coach in egypt to get a half decent job as evidence of that. jurgen has now managed bayern munich, germany, and the US. anyone doubt if he wasnt retained that he could get a better job than Egypt.

caleb porter screwed the pooch with the olympic roster
tab ramos? ok i could see that as a possibility
Kreis? as stated above, a little too green.
there are other american options we could go to, all unproven of course.

so then what? pay for some guy like a hiddink or capello? we already have a foreign manager, hiring another one would cause the problems Dolcem mentioned above with the American coaches and media.

On the field, we have improved miles technically. So Klinsmann isn't a great tactical manager. we aren't Italy, and we wont be anytime soon. I would rather improve our technical ability and confidence, and then worry about tactics.

We aren't in the top 8 in the world but you dont have to be to make the QF dolcem... remember that. and we are closer to 8 than we are to 24 i would say. i mean bosnia, greece, sweden? seriously these European teams wont show down in South America aside from the true class: germany, italy, spain, maybe holland. those other teams you are silently glorifying arent really that great. im more worried about colombia, uruguay, chile than I am about say russia or switzerland.

2tone
Ten-Towns
Post #26
Saturday October 12, 2013 3:58pm

Joined Jul 2012
Total Posts: 10,506
I have faith that the team will get a decent Group stage draw, and will subsequently get out of the group to the round of 16. After that, it's a crapshoot, anything can happen. The US could very well make the QF's.

The teams that look likely to make a deep run:

Germany
Spain
Italy
Holland
Argentina
Brasil
Colombia
Chile

Sorry not jumping on the Belgium bandwagon. They have talent, but not the pedigree in WC's.

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